I'm drowning....husband wants out

[FlyingHigh]

I know I have been in a frozen state. My friends have been saying that I sound depressed. I know what I should do but i have held back for hope and also because of disbelief. I just couldn't imagine my H betraying our family like that. But now I see that in his mind he believes that the kids are better off without me b/c he has made other plans while I always had the same plan. NO ONE would believe this right now!

Understandable. There is NOT one betrayed spouse, man or woman who has not gone through what you are going through right now. It HURTS to the core. Getting up in the morning was a challenge in itself. Heck, I lost 13 pounds in less than a month after D-day! That was the best part!

 

We didn't have kids. But you do. They are and should be your reason for LIVING. And I'm sure they are. So, anytime you start gett pissed off at your H for being a dick and acting like one, don't even give him the benefit of watching you react. Say nothing. In fact, pack up your kids and take them to the park or friend's house. Set up an arrangement with a friend or family member (not his side) where you and the kids can go whenever your H starts acting up like an immature dickhead.

 

He is a star stand up. Despite our difficulties, no one would ever think of him as a risk taker like that, He is always home, always doing chores, always good with the kids etc....

My stbxh was exactly yours. He created a "stellar," coudln't do wrong, perfect, charming, sensitive image personally and professionally. Cheaters go through extra length to create that image for themselves so they wouldn't be suspected of cheating. My H managed to live a double life for 2+ years. NO ONE had a clue he was capable of such a thing because he PLAYED the PERFECT husband, son, son-in law, friends, co-worker to everyone and anyone. But he was also passive aggressive and those personalities are by far the worse ones because they are like train wrecks. You never see it coming!

 

He has been bullying me and was sleeping on our bed while I slept with the kids UNTIL last nite. I think this is his own admission of his guilt b/c I found him out. I am treating him indifferent but my heart is gone. Maybe he expects me to go crazy. But I need to be calm now. Will do what is necessary now.

This is exactly what cheaters do. My stbxh made an effort of telling everyone how "unhappy" he was and what a controlling "b*tch" I was right about the time he started his affair. It justified his behavior so that in the end it justified his would be action to divorce me. Unfortunately, he didn't count on

1. his OW threatening him that if he didn't divorce me for her, she was going to come over to our home and hurt me. Thus, he was forced to confess
   
2. He didn't count on me exposing and destroying his stellar image.
   
3. He didn't count on me on finding "things," a gold mine of info the night of D-day when I kicked him out.
   
4. He didn't count on me in fighting back against him and his OW. I'm much more assertive than he is or the two of them combined and not afraid to rock the boat.

In the end, he's still not with the OW. Frankly, I couldn't give a crap if they were. I've happily moved on.

 

I truly wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt even if I gave him the divorce. I just wanted to make sure that I did all I can so my kids won't think that we changed their lives in haste.

And YOU HAVE! We, as betrayed spouse usually give our WS the benefit of the doubt to a point that we end up compromising our self-esteem and self-worth until we say enough is enough. That's probably why you are still in the state of mind where you are, at a lost as to what to do. So, anytime, you feel like this, lost, talk yourself to doing something proactive for you and your kids. You've been given PLENTY of great sound and legal advice...START doing them regardless.

 

Most of all, start healing yourself. Accept that YOU had nothing to do with his conscious decision to cheat. And that's exactly what it is! A CONSCIOUS DECISION!

 

Find a lesson in this experience for yourself. It's there. You may not realize it now. But it's there. I see it. But, I want you to figure this out yourself first and see if you can recognize it. If you can't see it, I'll tell you what I think that lesson is.

[mum2three]

Hi LJ,

 

I wasn't sure of what that meant. I don't believe deception like that can be reconciled especially with physical contact involved. He is denying like mad any sex or whatever but it is no good for me to try. He is being a total jackass to me and shoving blame at me for causing him to seek out this OW friendship. He thinks that she is his counselor!

 

He told me that she has encouraged him to try and remain in the M. I know it's a joke b/c all the phone calls indicate is a major codependent relationship. No "friend" would call you at work several times a day even though they empathize with your sitch. He claims to be so busy seeing patients all day yet he finds the time to chat with her at least 4x/day sometimes and then right before leaving work. Meanwhile, I am stressed at home and tired from being with kids all day and having no time to myself. I call him at 5pm to see when he is getting out. His response is I'm busy, I have one last patient to see but I see the call logs that he calls her right back after hanging up with me. Is that therapy?!

 

I could see there is a really backburner potential for reconciling if he was truly truly remorseful and can demonstrate a renewed commitment and love for me and family. Right now, he treats me like nothing and acts like he can get away with it. That is despicable. I don't think seeing this side of him would make me want to hold on to anything. I don't know what the future holds but it's not with him.

[FlyingHigh]

Hi LJ,

 

I wasn't sure of what that meant. I don't believe deception like that can be reconciled especially with physical contact involved. He is denying like mad any sex or whatever but it is no good for me to try. He is being a total jackass to me and shoving blame at me for causing him to seek out this OW friendship. He thinks that she is his counselor!

 

He told me that she has encouraged him to try and remain in the M. I know it's a joke b/c all the phone calls indicate is a major codependent relationship. No "friend" would call you at work several times a day even though they empathize with your sitch. He claims to be so busy seeing patients all day yet he finds the time to chat with her at least 4x/day sometimes and then right before leaving work. Meanwhile, I am stressed at home and tired from being with kids all day and having no time to myself. I call him at 5pm to see when he is getting out. His response is I'm busy, I have one last patient to see but I see the call logs that he calls her right back after hanging up with me. Is that therapy?!

 

I could see there is a really backburner potential for reconciling if he was truly truly remorseful and can demonstrate a renewed commitment and love for me and family. Right now, he treats me like nothing and acts like he can get away with it. That is despicable. I don't think seeing this side of him would make me want to hold on to anything. I don't know what the future holds but it's not with him.

Mum,

 

WHY do you play right into his hands?

 

FACT #1: Your H has already proven himself a cheat and a liar.

 

I could see there is a really backburner potential for reconciling if he was truly truly remorseful and can demonstrate a renewed commitment and love for me and family.

Get yourself OUT of this mode of thinking that a reconciliation is just around the corner! IT'S NOT! Reconcilation will ONLY happen once your H acknowledges his affair was a mistake AND makes a commitment to make amends to you and the marriage. He hasn't done either! And the more YOU PUSH him, the farther you will drive him away!!!

 

So, get a grip, Mum! Stop pushing him to be honest and committed!!! Much less have sex with you or recreate any intimacy with you! He's nowhere close to your expectations! Which by the way, you shouldn't be expecting certain outcome RIGHT NOW!!! You can't! AND you are NOT going to get any!!!

 

I don't think seeing this side of him would make me want to hold on to anything. I don't know what the future holds but it's not with him.

Then concetrate on yourself, the kids and your future!!! The future holds no guarantees for no one!! YOU create your own future. NOT your husband! NOT your marriage! NOT your children! BUT, your children's future depends on YOU!!! So DECIDE! You've two options:

 

1) Keep agonizing and analyzing every little flippin incident that your husband throws out at you and then allowing yourself to play right into your his hands OR

 

2) Cpme up with your OWN LIFE PROGRAM!

 

PICK ONE!

[Ladyjane14]

 

I wasn't sure of what that meant.

 

It's a bit confusing, particularly in that FH and I might have seemed at first glance to be in disagreement about it. In actuality, I don't think we are. What I'm advocating though is that you use this tool with the greatest care and that you make absolutely certain that you're utilizing your attorney's council.

 

Exposure, in short... is shining the light on the affair, exposing it to the few key people who can be instrumental in helping to end it.

 

Here's a reprint of what I told you before (I'm sparing my typing fingers! )

 

... if you don't know who he's seeing, you also don't know what her particular situation is. She might have a spouse and kids of her own. And what works to pop your WH's bubble, might work just as handily popping OW's.

 

Say for example, she's also 'married with kids' and is busily perpetrating the same scheme in her own home.... the old "I-love-you-but-I'm-not-IN-LOVE-with-you-let's-get-a-nice-amicable-divorce" tactic.

 

Well that's not going to work NEARLY as well when hubby finds out what she's been up to is it? She'd have problems of her own to deal with at that point.

 

And even if she's single, there are still people around her she'd have to deal with. Say, she met your husband through work... Well, you think she's going to enjoy her job half as much when her boss finds out she's behaving inappropriately with married doctors?

 

So, you see how "THE PLAN" starts falling apart once a few key people are made aware of the facts.

 

Now, I personally don't advocate "Exposure" to the the degree they commonly recommend it at marriagebuilders. It's a double-edged sword that can cut the betrayed spouse just as deeply as it cuts the WS. You can't go around as some do, behaving in a manner more befitting to Chicken Little crying out that "the sky is falling".

 

But in the right hands, applied to just the right areas.... 'Exposure' becomes a scalpel, cutting the cancer out of your marriage.

 

You can't use it until you know who the key players are though. You NEED to get your hands on that information, and you need to get it quickly before the divorce progresses too much further. This is imperative.

 

So you see how the OW's spouse (if she has one) has the potential to be a key player in destroying the affair. REALITY intrudes upon FANTASY, and the stress of it causes the affair partners to sometimes pick each other apart.

 

The danger in using Exposure is that sometimes we end up telling more people than we really needed to. The selectees should always be people who are likely to bring gentle pressure to the adulterers.

 

And of course, the reason I want you to seek legal counsel is obvious. The difference between the TRUTH and Slander is having the proof in your hand. I honestly do believe that your husband's strategy, piller of the community that he is ... will be to try and make YOU look unstable. So, you don't want to come off as the "Chicken Little" of the piece.

 

If things go down bad, you'll always have the ability to 'SCORCH THE EARTH' with exposure later on down the pike. But for right now, the better policy is to only speak truthswhich can be supported by evidence, and only to the key people that can put pressure on the affair partners.

 

 

 

I could see there is a really backburner potential for reconciling if he was truly truly remorseful and can demonstrate a renewed commitment and love for me and family. Right now, he treats me like nothing and acts like he can get away with it. That is despicable. I don't think seeing this side of him would make me want to hold on to anything. I don't know what the future holds but it's not with him.

 

You can't expect "remorse" or decent treatment from a WH. He's not the husband you once knew right now. While under-the-influence of the affair, he's a totally different person.

 

If it helps, picture the guy you once knew and loved as this WH's hostage. It remains to be seen if your old husband will survive this experience or not. But one thing's for certain... as long as the affair is underway, he is submerged. It won't be until 'the new car smell' wears off the OW until we see who's left standing.

 

This duality is common in waywards. This too, is NOT about you. Internalizing it allows the WH to hit the bullseye and push you further away. You don't have to assist him in that.

 

Recognize that the REASON the WH treats you badly is that he's afraid of you. If he treats you with kindness, he's liable to backslide on his determination to follow the affair and end the marriage.

 

Likewise, the secrecy which shrouds him protects his vulnerability. He doesn't want to lose his status in the family or in the community. These fears are YOUR tools. Use them carefully until you've resolved your own feelings.

[stillafool]

Hi LJ,

 

I wasn't sure of what that meant. I don't believe deception like that can be reconciled especially with physical contact involved. He is denying like mad any sex or whatever but it is no good for me to try. He is being a total jackass to me and shoving blame at me for causing him to seek out this OW friendship. He thinks that she is his counselor!

 

Why on earth are you trying to seduce him? He has made it clear how he feels about you and I would kick him out of the master bedroom and make him sleep elsewhere. This is going to make him want you less

 

He told me that she has encouraged him to try and remain in the M. I know it's a joke b/c all the phone calls indicate is a major codependent relationship. No "friend" would call you at work several times a day even though they empathize with your sitch. He claims to be so busy seeing patients all day yet he finds the time to chat with her at least 4x/day sometimes and then right before leaving work.

 

 

Stop worrying about him and the OW. Yes you are right it isn't fair and he probably is in love with this OW. You have to accept this now and decide what you are going to do with you and your kids. You mentioned in another post that you want to confront her. That isn't going to serve any purpose except to make you feel worse and embarass yourself at his office. Even if she denies it or whatever she isn't going to give up her chance to be with a doctor who has at least two offices, etc. Especially if he wants her too.

 

 

Meanwhile, I am stressed at home and tired from being with kids all day and having no time to myself. I call him at 5pm to see when he is getting out. His response is I'm busy, I have one last patient to see but I see the call logs that he calls her right back after hanging up with me. Is that therapy?!

 

Mum, I don't mean to be disrespectful, but it's your job to take care of your children. You are blessed to be able to stay home with your children, as so many women wish they could stay home and be a full time mom. I hope you don't complain to your husband about not being physcially able to care for them as he may use this to get full custody of them. I would act like it is my joy to care for the kids. You have to put your childrens interest ahead of your own pain.

 

I could see there is a really backburner potential for reconciling if he was truly truly remorseful and can demonstrate a renewed commitment and love for me and family. Right now, he treats me like nothing and acts like he can get away with it. That is despicable. I don't think seeing this side of him would make me want to hold on to anything. I don't know what the future holds but it's not with him.

 

No he does not want to reconcile and has made it perfectly clear. You have to stop thinking that there is a chance for reconciliation. He loves his children and doesn't want to lose them. You have to talk to an attorney today. Every day you wait he is gaining ground on you. It is obvious he has talked to his attorney. Your divorce is inevitable and you must start to accept this fact and decide what you are going to do for you. If you don't wake up and get yourself together you may find yourself without your home and your kids.

[FlyingHigh]

Absolutely agree with LJ.

 

Affairs thrive in secrecy. With your H's profession in which "image" plays a very important role in the community, cheating on his wife with a subordinate IS and being exposed would be the last thing he wants on his record.

 

So, you essentially hold a very important trump card, so to speak, especially if you haven't exposed his affair.

 

The first people you should expose to would be within both sides of the family. If the OW is married, let her betrayed husband know. Your H and the OW, will certainly be upset with you as they should because NOW, their dirty secret is out.

 

If the OW does work with him and she's not one of the physicians, there is usually an "office policy" with regards to in house dating especially if it's between someone who is in higher position as your husband and the other party is a subordinate...office gal. A part of "sexual harrassment" polcy implemented by companies to avoid potential lawsuits.

 

If your husband is a staff physician and does not own the clinic, AND such a policy exist, he could very well be asked to resign. Excercise this option ONLY once you decided what you're going to do and that you've got what you want. BUT, this knowledge and information can be a VERY POWERFUL tool...a leverage so to speak. Just don't let him in on it. In other words, have proofs before you expose OUTSIDE of the family.

[stillafool]

I understand what you are saying. But even if the OW has a H and you tell him, there is an office policy saying "no dating", and even if your husband's job is threatened by his affair - it still is not going to make him want Mum again. He has made his feelings too clear and has not left a crack in the door for reconciliation. All these things are just going to make him hate her more. Trying to get revenge is not healthy. Let God take care of that for you. The only energy you need to expend is getting your business in order for you and your children. I think it's great you have proof of another woman for your divorce case. Once you contact an attorney he/she will advise you of what to do.

[stillafool]

Mum is do you really want to reconcile with him? After the things he has said to you, the way he has and is treating you and to find out he has another woman? You deserve so much better. I wouldn't beg after him one bit. I wouldn't even try to have a family unit including him after what he said to you. If he told you how he feels about you, believe him. I would just keep insisting that he leave my home and go to his OW or a hotel. No woman has to put up with a cheating h staying in the house. They get thrown out every day. Don't leave your home no matter what he says. I wouldn't make it comfortable for him by letting him stay in the Master bedroom. After sleeping on the sofa for a while maybe he will decide to get his own place. I guarantee you you will feel better when he has moved out of your home, then your healing can begin. Call your lawyer today.

[Ladyjane14]

I understand what you are saying. But even if the OW has a H and you tell him, there is an office policy saying "no dating", and even if your husband's job is threatened by his affair - it still is not going to make him want Mum again. He has made his feelings too clear and has not left a crack in the door for reconciliation. All these things are just going to make him hate her more. Trying to get revenge is not healthy. Let God take care of that for you. The only energy you need to expend is getting your business in order for you and your children. I think it's great you have proof of another woman for your divorce case. Once you contact an attorney he/she will advise you of what to do.

 

This isn't about revenge, Stillafool. These are tried and tested methods as designed by Dr. Willard Harley.

 

The affair itself is the major impediment to Mum's husband "wanting her" again. Once that is dealt with... ANYTHING is possible.

 

And the possibilities are well worthy of exploration when the family dynamic hangs in the balance. We're talking about handing the babies their little suitcases once a week so they can go to Daddy's new house. We're talking about constant issues of who bought what outfit, or who's paying for ballet, or which rules of discipline will be followed in each household. We're talking about little arms squeezing Mommy's neck and sometimes crying pitifully because they don't want to let go. We're talking about walking the floors of our empty home, sleepless, and missing the soft little night sounds of family life.

 

Now, there are ALOT of folks who take those lemons and make lemonade. It remains to be seen if that will be Mum's path. But still, it's not a decision made lightly because some OW's got her hooks into somebody else's husband and they feature themselves to be "in love".

[Mz. Pixie]

We're talking about handing the babies their little suitcases once a week so they can go to Daddy's new house. We're talking about constant issues of who bought what outfit, or who's paying for ballet, or which rules of discipline will be followed in each household. We're talking about little arms squeezing Mommy's neck and sometimes crying pitifully because they don't want to let go. We're talking about walking the floors of our empty home, sleepless, and missing the soft little night sounds of family life.

 

 

WOW, excellent post LJ. The above is all true and more than reason enough to fight for your marriage should you choose to do so.

 

You should have already gone to an attorney Mum, and I'm worried about your future should you not make that trip asap. He's already talked with his, and you need to be prepared, even if you want to work on the marriage.

 

Please please please see an attorney NOW to see what your rights are. Then, go with exposure. He's going to be MEGA PISSED when you do it, so be prepared! But it still needs to be done if you want to save your marriage.

[mum2three]

Your posts blow me away. Thank you for the super indepth advice. I don't think I have that same clarity right now. I was consumed with the cell records for 1 full day where I couldn't do much but stare at them and piecing together the time line.

 

I called my counselor and requested an emergency session b/c she had to cancel 2x on me for flu and such. H was suppose to go with me so we don't have to banter everytime we talk about anything. We are scheduled to go at 1:30pm today. I am surprised he is going but what the heck. We need to be able to communicate about the kids future minus the emotions.

 

No, I DID NOT try to seduce him. We can't be near each other now. I happened to already be in the master watching tv so he opted not to be around me and went to the couch. I was the one sleeping with the kids since Thanksgiving because I was so hurt and he asked me to give him the space. I think he had always expected me to move aside and he didn't have that leverage when I confronted him the cell logs.

 

Regarding the exposure of OW. No, I am not scared to confront her but i would not be stupid enough to make a scene at the workplace. I want to show her that I exist and pictures of our family in our happier times. I want to tell her off and tell her that I won't stand for her having a hand in ruining my family. She is a "front desk" girl/receptionist or some sort. I can easily call her to confront her too as I have her home, cell, and pager numbers. She is a single mom. I don't know anyone on her side to expose this info. Obviously, i don't want my husband fired b/c we will all need the money after the D.

 

But this is my life and anybody messing with it is going to get marked. The M, the kids, and the family was mine. My H was stupid enough to jeopardize it and she was stupid enough to think she was going to get away with it. Life isn't that easy. If you are going to mess with another woman's man and help break up their family then you just don't get to walk away.

 

i don't know what her reaction would be but I know that it is impossible for her to feel comfortable and happy meeting me. If she chooses to be smug then I will reinforce that she can't keep up the charade. As a single mom, she wouldn't want to lose her job either.

 

I wouldn't confront her for the sake of retaining my M. It is show of force and self worth and I represent my kids voices. I would NEVER beg him to stay. If he and her chooses to hook up officially after the D then it's still a stupid move for him. He'll look like a complete idiot to his colleagues for dumping his wife and breaking up his family for the front desk girl. His plan is not going to last for long. I am not going to be there to pick up his pieces. A jerk deserves to feel all the pain that he has caused.

 

It is really not about me. My H chose not to deal with our M and address our issues with me. He made that decision to seek a "personal counselot" who can stroke his freakin' ego.

 

The family dynamics are going to suck either way. There is no good plan to feel that these kids are getting a fair share of mommy & daddy. They are so young and needy and don';t have a voice. The empty house etc...

 

gotta go to apt. will update.

[stillafool]

.

 

The family dynamics are going to suck either way. There is no good plan to feel that these kids are getting a fair share of mommy & daddy. They are so young and needy and don';t have a voice. The empty house etc...

 

 

Unforturnately this is the truth Mum, there is no good plan that will give the kids a fair share of the two of you. This is because of what your husband has done to their life and you having to make adjustments. You do sound stronger today and I'm glad for you. I can't believe your husband (a doctor) gets his counseling from the "front desk/girl/receptionist", how cheap of him.

[FlyingHigh]

Regarding the exposure of OW. No, I am not scared to confront her but i would not be stupid enough to make a scene at the workplace. I want to show her that I exist and pictures of our family in our happier times. I want to tell her off and tell her that I won't stand for her having a hand in ruining my family.

NOW, that's the spirit, Mum!

 

The M, the kids, and the family was mine. My H was stupid enough to jeopardize it and she was stupid enough to think she was going to get away with it.

The M, kids and family are STILL yours regardless! That OW is nothing more than looking for a "free ride" and sees your H as her "golden parachute".

 

She is a "front desk" girl/receptionist or some sort. I can easily call her to confront her too as I have her home, cell, and pager numbers. She is a single mom.

Don't bother calling her. Anytime you contact the OW is an opportunity for her to contact your H who will in turn against you. Been there done that!

 

Your most POWERFUL TOOL to stop the affair is the fact that your H is just a staff physican and does not HOLD the golden rule. YOU DO!!!

 

If I were in your position and the next time he blows off on you, I would nonchalantly say in a "casual" way, "Do the board of directors and human resource department in your clinic know you have been having an affair with the receptionist?" Leave it at that and let him squirm. You're not admitting to being the "whistle blower". All you're doing is "planting the seed". Bet your petunias he'll be looking at his career, reputation and life flash right into the dumps.

 

If he comes back and say, "you wouldn't dare". Reply with a smile and say, "Well, dear you certainly had a lot of courage to jeopardize and risk losing everything the minute you made the conscious decision to cheat with the receptionist, didn't you?" This is called double talk where you are throwing the affair back in his face without really trying.

 

I guarantee you his "thought" of his little dirty secret be known throughout the clinic (although you won't succumb to it:D ) it be like you kneeing him in the balls where it will hurt the most!

 

Obviously, i don't want my husband fired b/c we will all need the money after the D.

And you won't. This would not be very smart. But there IS still the possibility of him losing his job if there is such a policy should the word get around. Sadly, this is exactly what cheaters risk...losing everything they ever worked for.

 

It is a damn shame that people are more fearful of the IRS for losing their home and getting their credit ruined for not paying their taxes than they are losing their reputation, family, career, finances for the sake of fulfilling self-gratification cowardly by cheating.

[FlyingHigh]

Mum is do you really want to reconcile with him? After the things he has said to you, the way he has and is treating you and to find out he has another woman? You deserve so much better. I wouldn't beg after him one bit. I wouldn't even try to have a family unit including him after what he said to you. If he told you how he feels about you, believe him. I would just keep insisting that he leave my home and go to his OW or a hotel. No woman has to put up with a cheating h staying in the house. They get thrown out every day. Don't leave your home no matter what he says. I wouldn't make it comfortable for him by letting him stay in the Master bedroom. After sleeping on the sofa for a while maybe he will decide to get his own place. I guarantee you you will feel better when he has moved out of your home, then your healing can begin. Call your lawyer today.

Affair is a symptom of what's going on in any marriage or relationship.

 

Affair can either destroy a marriage or make it stronger. Upon discovery of the an affair, it is the ongoing cheating and lying that will eventually kill the marriage or any relationship.

 

For every cheating and betrayed spouse, there are lessons to be learned as a result of an affair. It's up to each party to decipher and learn from it. If they don't, the same lesson will come back until they get it right. That's part of life.

 

Why people cheat and become victims have a lot to do with their individual upbringing. After all, we are all a "sum product" of our past. And if we don't deal with them or confront them, we will most likely be faced with the same predicament. Same problem. Same situaltion. Different day. Same result...which is to 1) understand why and then 2) resolve it so you don't end up in the same situation.

 

If your solution is to just throw in the towel after one hurdle then you have just denied yourself an important lesson. It's easier to walk away, throw in the towel BECAUSE it doesn't require WORK. No different than a cheating spouse taking an easy way out of a marriage by getting his/her needs fulfilled because it's "EASIER" just as long as the innocent spouse doesn't find out rather than working the marriage and find a solution. Either way, what is there to be learned in the process by taking the easy way out? Nothing!

 

All it proves is immaturity, selfishness, coward, irresponsible and not to mention, risking the life of an innocent spouse of sexually transmitted diseases and potentially their unborn children. Powerful consequences, don't you think? But often ignored by cheaters!

 

For Mum, or any betrayed or cheating spouse, divorce should only be a choice of last resort IF they can look at ending the marriage WITHOUT any regrets. Mum is NOT there yet nor is her husband, despite his wanting out. This is the mentality of cheaters. A fantasy in which they can easily waltz out of one marriage into the arms of another and NOT think of the consequences. After all, he wouldn't be going to counseling at all.

[Mz. Pixie]

He'll look like a complete idiot to his colleagues for dumping his wife and breaking up his family for the front desk girl.

 

Eh, that depends. Some of his male colleagues may think it's cool for him to be with a younger woman- you never know.

 

This just sort of reinforces what I've read in His Needs/Her Needs, how to affair proof your marriage. He has a chapter in there about men and their most important emotional need (sexual fufillment) and how even the most moral of men will lose their jobs, their positions in industry, their homes and children and even lose their ministry over a piece of *ss. I've seen it happen in churches where I've attended as well.

 

The OW is really not the issue here though Mum. I can understand that you want to really blame her more than him- because you love him. But, really, the total blame for this rests on your H. He was the one who made vows with you, he was the one who cheated on you. Sure she was involved, but in reality, if he would have said "No" then there wouldn't have been an affair.

[mum2three]

You mentioned that ur husband defended her? How did that play out? I am planning on dropping by tomorrow.

 

Btw, we just got back from counseling. He didn't make any future apts. so I will keep my individual. He made it clear at the session that he there is no love for me and this is final. So I also made it clear that we need to have two separate households asap. He says the finances are tight and I said that he just can't dump it all in the education funds! There are consequences and sacrifices that everyone must make b/c he is no longer in love.

 

This session was productive b/c it made him realize that we can't power struggle to stay in the same home if it is not working and breaking us down even more. Mental sanity is primary right now.

[mum2three]

No, other woman is not really to blame but I have already put the responsibility on my H for this sitch. BUT I cannot let her sit on the sidelines enjoying the movie. This is my life and neither my H nor OW is going to walk away with a free conscience. That would just be too easy with the big price tag that my kids & I had to pay.

 

My focus is not her but getting my H to see the reality of life that he has created for his kids. So if he has to clean out the savings to start a 2 family household then he can start looking for apts. tomorrow. I think he expects me to get a job and then find a place and support myself. He wants everything to be easy for him. I told the counselor that I will find employment at my time and it should not have anything to do with what we need to accomplish now. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

[mum2three]

If your solution is to just throw in the towel after one hurdle then you have just denied yourself an important lesson. It's easier to walk away, throw in the towel BECAUSE it doesn't require WORK. No different than a cheating spouse taking an easy way out of a marriage by getting his/her needs fulfilled because it's "EASIER" just as long as the innocent spouse doesn't find out rather than working the marriage and find a solution. Either way, what is there to be learned in the process by taking the easy way out? Nothing!

 

All it proves is immaturity, selfishness, coward, irresponsible and not to mention, risking the life of an innocent spouse of sexually transmitted diseases and potentially their unborn children. Powerful consequences, don't you think? But often ignored by cheaters!

 

I am not sure that you are saying this in reference to staying in the same relationship or learning a lesson to prevent the same sitch in future relationships. I don't have an answer when my H is absolutely dead set against us and acts like he hates. I can't see further than how he treats me right now. It is asking alot of me to leave the door ajar so that we can have a future together. At this point, his affair exposed, his admancy for D and lack of love for me is sealing the deal. I hate his passive aggressive personality. I can see him doing this again if we don't settle it once and for all. So if he walks then I guess it is the right thing. But I won't tolerate less than what i deserve in a marriage.

 

He kept saying that there is no spark and chemistry between us. Well, I do say that OW is creating some excitement in his humdrum life. He chose not to invest in our marriage and family so he is responsible for not maintaining our relationship too. Spark is gone when u have 3 kids and a household to run. But a friendship well tended to is everlasting. A little hand holding and softness goes along way with a life long partner.

 

Spark is great if you are the front desk girl wearing low cut blouses and smiling all day is part of your job. How long is that going to last when reality kicks in and she has to manage her kids and mine. Give me a break!

[stillafool]

Affair is a symptom of what's going on in any marriage or relationship.

 

Affair can either destroy a marriage or make it stronger. Upon discovery of the an affair, it is the ongoing cheating and lying that will eventually kill the marriage or any relationship.

 

For every cheating and betrayed spouse, there are lessons to be learned as a result of an affair. It's up to each party to decipher and learn from it. If they don't, the same lesson will come back until they get it right. That's part of life.

 

Why people cheat and become victims have a lot to do with their individual upbringing. After all, we are all a "sum product" of our past. And if we don't deal with them or confront them, we will most likely be faced with the same predicament. Same problem. Same situaltion. Different day. Same result...which is to 1) understand why and then 2) resolve it so you don't end up in the same situation.

 

If your solution is to just throw in the towel after one hurdle then you have just denied yourself an important lesson. It's easier to walk away, throw in the towel BECAUSE it doesn't require WORK. No different than a cheating spouse taking an easy way out of a marriage by getting his/her needs fulfilled because it's "EASIER" just as long as the innocent spouse doesn't find out rather than working the marriage and find a solution. Either way, what is there to be learned in the process by taking the easy way out? Nothing!

 

All it proves is immaturity, selfishness, coward, irresponsible and not to mention, risking the life of an innocent spouse of sexually transmitted diseases and potentially their unborn children. Powerful consequences, don't you think? But often ignored by cheaters!

 

For Mum, or any betrayed or cheating spouse, divorce should only be a choice of last resort IF they can look at ending the marriage WITHOUT any regrets. Mum is NOT there yet nor is her husband, despite his wanting out. This is the mentality of cheaters. A fantasy in which they can easily waltz out of one marriage into the arms of another and NOT think of the consequences. After all, he wouldn't be going to counseling at all.

 

FH, I would agree with this if the circumstances were different. If Mum's husband had had an affair and showed remorse and wanted to keep his marriage, I would say definitely do what it takes to keep your marriage together. Anyone can make a mistake. Even if he were unsure about what he wanted I would say keep the door open for him. This man has stated over and over he's not in love and doesn't want to be married anymore and is not going to change his mind. I think one would have to be crazy not to look toward moving on with their life after someone has told them this. If when her h is away and realizes he made a mistake and wants to reconcile she can deal with that then, but right now she needs to think of what she is going to do for her and her kids.

[FlyingHigh]

You mentioned that ur husband defended her? How did that play out? I am planning on dropping by tomorrow.

quote]

They always do. It didn't backfire. It provided an opportunity for her to get her claws deeper into him and gave him more kudos to view me as what he originally claim to everyone that I was a controlling "b*tch". Yet, his OW gave him an ultimatum that if he didn't divorce me for her, she was going to come over to our home and hurt me. Go figure...

 

Neither stbxh or his OW knew I had a lot of leverage againts them simply by their stupidity and my playing smart in their own game. I also STOPPED playing the "victim".

 

The times I confronted stbxh's OW (by phone) was to find out if she were pregnant because hubby stuttered when I asked him on D-day ato her that hubby and to tell her that I wasn't going to give up on my marriage. Hindsight, I wouldn't have done that because some women thrives on that kind of challenge. Then she had the audicity to tell me she "understood" what I was going through because her XH of 10 years also cheated on her. Yep! And when I replied, "Then why in God's name would you turn around and do it to another woman's husband?" Her reply? "But it's not the same". You see, even the OW had the same mentality as cheating hubby. They're not to blame....

 

I exposed stbxh and his OW to a full blown exposure. But at that point, I was done. In the end, the exposure did not kill the marriage. It was his ongoing cheating and lying that killed the marriage which is usually the case with infidelity. What the exposure did was it ended the affair. It got his family and closes friends to force him to look at what he did.

 

Like your H's OW, my stbxh's OW was just as stupid, more so, and dumber. Even stbxh considered her as "stupid" when his OW told her two teen girls that H would move in with them and become a family. But, you see, even hubby shifted blame on his OW when caught in his own web of lies.

 

If you're going to confront the OW tomorrow, dress to kill with a lot of class. Of course you can always confront her in the same way as Dr. Shepard's wife in "Grey's Anatomy" with a hint of Joan Collins attitude in "Dynasty"..."So, you're the receptionist my husband been screwing". OKay, maybe not....

 

Whatever and however you confront her, do it with class and grace because you may never know whose watching.

[FlyingHigh]

FH, I would agree with this if the circumstances were different. If Mum's husband had had an affair and showed remorse and wanted to keep his marriage, I would say definitely do what it takes to keep your marriage together. Anyone can make a mistake. Even if he were unsure about what he wanted I would say keep the door open for him. This man has stated over and over he's not in love and doesn't want to be married anymore and is not going to change his mind. I think one would have to be crazy not to look toward moving on with their life after someone has told them this. If when her h is away and realizes he made a mistake and wants to reconcile she can deal with that then, but right now she needs to think of what she is going to do for her and her kids.

Again, Mum is NOT at the point of throwing in the towel regardless how many times her husband uttered those words. Her husband is still deeply involved in the fantasy of the affair.

 

Affair is like a drug addiction. Affairs thrive in secrecy. Like drug addicts, they get their fix however they can get it...usually through lying and cheating. And like drug addicts, they go through withdrawal before they can detox themselves. Her husband is still haven't reached the withdrawal stage, a part of the process before a marriage has a shot of recovering from infidelity.

[mum2three]

I think they both deserve it even though it was all under his control. I will stake out my plan and verbal speech (if we are alone she is going to get a tirade). I am not taking crap from her or my H.

 

Since he made his feelings and position loud and clear at counseling then we really need to move on. But if he moves out he can choose to keep in touch with her. But I'm not tolerating that bs under my roof. If he is that dependent on her then he needs to move in with her. No one is going to play babysitter and backup without love, respect, & money. It's called alimony & childsupport!

[FlyingHigh]

I think they both deserve it even though it was all under his control. I will stake out my plan and verbal speech (if we are alone she is going to get a tirade). I am not taking crap from her or my H.

 

Since he made his feelings and position loud and clear at counseling then we really need to move on. But if he moves out he can choose to keep in touch with her. But I'm not tolerating that bs under my roof. If he is that dependent on her then he needs to move in with her. No one is going to play babysitter and backup without love, respect, & money. It's called alimony & childsupport!

Is this your final decision, Mum? If it is, then what's the point of you going over to confront the OW tomorrow? Is it for closure? You are doing the same exact thing as Delarocha did. You are contradicting yourself!

 

On one post you say:

If he is that dependent on her then he needs to move in with her. No one is going to play babysitter and backup without love, respect, & money. It's called alimony & childsupport!

 

But in an earlier one, you said:

I want to tell her off and tell her that I won't stand for her having a hand in ruining my family.

Notice how you contradict yourself here Mum? DECIDE which route you want to take and figure out what your steps are. Granted, emotions are high, but you need to step back and make sure it is what you want to do. Once you initiate the first step in either direction, there's very little room for turning back. Ending the marriage is always an option.

 

In my earlier post today, I wrote:

Find a lesson in this experience for yourself. It's there. You may not realize it now. But it's there. I see it. But, I want you to figure this out yourself first and see if you can recognize it. If you can't see it, I'll tell you what I think that lesson is.

 

And your reply is:

I am not sure that you are saying this in reference to staying in the same relationship or learning a lesson to prevent the same sitch in future relationships. I don't have an answer when my H is absolutely dead set against us and acts like he hates.

Herein lies your lesson, Mum. Take a look within yourself. What were the reasons your husband was attracted to you from the beginning? What qualities do you have that attracted him to you? Likewise, what were the qualities that you found attractive in him besides the obvious, a succesful career and a great financial provider? And for most men today, they really DON'T want to be just that! They're looking for equal partner and women with a little bit of indpendence, children or not.

 

Many of us can't relate to having a nanny or a housekeeper. Many of the readers you find on LS don't have the luxury of having either or both. Was having the assistance due to your medical condition? Don't quite remember what medical condition you are suffering from. But my point is, was the decision of having a nanny/housekeeper was for indefinite period of time or until such time at which you would fully recover?

 

So it begs the question, has your medical condition limited you ability to become independent in some manner or another? Are you homebound because of it?

 

There's a lot of things you haven't mentioned that seems questionable at best. So far you have a listed your disappointments, aggravation, feelings of betrayal and what a hateful person your husband has been towards you, but you have yet to examine what role you might have played in his looking elsewhere regardless how unacceptable his decision to cheat is.

 

If you read, "HIS NEEDS/HER NEEDS" on www.marriagebuilders.com, you would have some idea the connection to some of the reasons why infidelity occurs. And it may have helped take a look at yourself a little closer.

 

As in your case, perhaps, your husband took the back seat behind your children and medical condition? Think about it. In much of your posts, you indicated that your inability to nurture your marriage and put your husband and marriage a priority because of children rearing and medical condition, where do you think your husband belongs? Have you even considered this scenario? If the situation were reversed, say, your husband put his career first before you, wouldn't you the least feel a bit slided? And you know what? That's exactly how you're feeling, isn't? His affair has put you, marriage and the family on the back burner. Think about it.

 

So, as long as you and any women who uses children as an excuse to not nurture a marriage, the marriage itself is vulnerable to anything.

 

You also indicated that his family doesn't like you. WHY? This speaks volume and worth looking into. Does it have anything to do with your medical condition? Again it comes back to what do you have to offer on the table besides being a loyal wife and superb mother?

 

In other words, what have you done in the "wife/partner/lover" department?

 

Think about it...

[mum2three]

I know that I put my H on the back burner b/c of my condition this year and taking care of the kids. I am not wealthy either but needed extra physical help with kids until I was better. People are disillusioned if they think a nanny does everything. I was still there side by side to care for the kids. My 3 kids were all toddlers at the time and there was no way one person can do it all. So despite the fact that I did have help, it wasn't like I just layed on the couch all day. I had to take care of the kids thru my pain. At the end of the day, I was wiped.

 

It was a tough year and I was gettting much better with phys. therapy. But toward Sept. when everything was settling for me he decides to really withdraw from the M. But during the whole time that I was going thru this pain he was not supportive or empathetic. At the time when it was my worse, I had nothing left to give as a wife and it was difficult to keep up with the kids. But i did not know what the hell was going on with my body. I felt his anger towards me for not doing my share but I just couldn't at the time.

 

If he felt slighted, I most certainly did too. We needed help big time. He decided to take a turning point and not communicate with me, took off his ring in May, and from the phone records have found solice somewhere else. So everything was lacking for the both of us but not b/c I didn't want to. But I couldn't connect with him anymore. So it's not about holding out on being his lover but both of us lost that connection on trying to nurture the relationship. He never verbalized his needs but his actions scream resentment.

 

Regarding his family not liking me is b/c they are super traditional. His mother waits on her H hand and foot. He is worse than a child. So she couldn't empathize why I couldn't do the same. I think my H contradicts himself. He would like me to be his equal by contributing financially yet be the perfect mom, lover, and housekeeper. Well, I just couldn't do all that this year. I needed my time to heal. I am defintely not homebound, thank god! But where is the strength of a M when a spouse can't be there for you in sickness and in health??

 

There are lots that I can bring to the table but not with my own efforts alone. At this point, I am confused by your "lesson" or maybe I just don't see it.

 

Regarding your advice...... "Herein lies your lesson, Mum. Take a look within yourself. What were the reasons your husband was attracted to you from the beginning? What qualities do you have that attracted him to you? Likewise, what were the qualities that you found attractive in him besides the obvious, a succesful career and a great financial provider? And for most men today, they really DON'T want to be just that! They're looking for equal partner and women with a little bit of indpendence, children or not."

 

Does that really matter at this point? He is not looking at me with anything but disdain. He just wants to get rid of me at this point so I don't know how to take that suggestion. What I plan to do for myself is to re-establish myself, GAL, and take of me and my kids. I am going to be happy for me regardless of how the M turns out.

 

Are you suggesting that i take the high road and not deal with OW b/c it may bring finality to my M?? Confronting OW is not for closure to seal the deal on my M. I just want to stand up for what i believe in just like confronting my H about her. I am not a weak person but I always like to please and don't rock the boat unless it's really necessary. (Oh, I understand Delarocha's story well )

[FlyingHigh]

I know that I put my H on the back burner b/c of my condition this year and taking care of the kids.

This admission alone says a lot. And that's probably one of the contributing factors that drive people to get their emotional needs met outside of the marriage. My guess is this is probably "when" your husband started to look elsewhere to get his emotional needs. Whether or not it's from a waitress or a front desk receptionist, the fact is that the OW did meet what was missing in him.

 

The lesson: Whether or not your marriage ends up in divorce, you will have to learn to FIND a BALANCE between your daily hurdles, family and marriage. If you don't learn or teach yourself to discover that balance, you will find yourself in the same predicament in future relationships. Additionally, the reality is that it will equally a challenge for the next guy to deal with you if you do not resolve and FIND that balance.

 

There are lots that I can bring to the table but not with my own efforts alone. At this point, I am confused by your "lesson" or maybe I just don't see it.

Marriage requires equal efforts by both parties. What seems to have happened is that neither your or your husband "discussed" the parameters with regards to nurturing the marriage in conjuction with your medical condition. This is nothing new. As with majority of failed marriages, MISCOMMUNICATION is a big culprit. You "expected" that your husband should have supported you in times of need as you went through your medical hurdles, but he didn't. As a result, his non supportive stance has become a justification to use against him. On the other hand, in his mind, you neglected him.

 

The Lesson: If you are going to expect a certain end result, communicate those goals and desires.

 

Regarding his family not liking me is b/c they are super traditional. His mother waits on her H hand and foot. He is worse than a child. So she couldn't empathize why I couldn't do the same.

Again, this variance is the result of certain expections from each other. Did he think you were going to change and become like his mother once you two got married? Or did you give him any indication that you would?

 

Does that really matter at this point? He is not looking at me with anything but disdain. He just wants to get rid of me at this point so I don't know how to take that suggestion. What I plan to do for myself is to re-establish myself, GAL, and take of me and my kids. I am going to be happy for me regardless of how the M turns out.

YES, it does matter! If you don't see the lesson behind this, it will come back to haunt you. Life is like a boomerang. If you don't take the time to figure some of life's lesson, it will keep coming back until you get it right. That's part of life regardless whether or not your ultimate goal IS to take care of yourself and your kids.

 

I am going to be happy for me regardless of how the M turns out.

Happiness is attained by understanding. Understand the value behind this experience. Whether you care to admit it or not, it is there. Don't ignore it.

 

(Oh, I understand Delarocha's story well )

If this is the case, then you should be able to see that he has slowly but finally come to "understand" himself and is learning. You're not quite there yet, Mum.