MM's D strategy unacceptable

[wtd]

Most folks face "whether" MM will D, my problem is "when". I'm convinced MM is determined to D, however he wants to wait till W gets tenure (academic job guaranteed for life), because if D before she gets tenure, then financial settlement involving pension will be severe, and she may even contest the D. Meanwhile he's doing everything to help her get tenure, and she will in all likelihood get it, which will be at least 3 years more to wait! My concern is that the longer a M lasts, the more issues with D, not to mention the unforeseeable problems. Is MM's "strategy" anywhere near reasonable? Comments sought and welcome!

[oyster]

yes it is unacceptable as he values cash outflow more than being with you full time.

 

Of course should you be together the less cash outflow the better. But remember the hardest part for him is to LEAVE his wife.

 

I think it is another reason / tactic to prolong the affair for his own selfishness

[littlekitty]

It does seem to provide a nice excuse for him have his cake and eat it.

 

Another 3 years married, probably having sex with his wife and you....

[RecordProducer]

Most folks face "whether" MM will D, my problem is "when". I'm convinced MM is determined to D, however he wants to wait till W gets tenure (academic job guaranteed for life), because if D before she gets tenure, then financial settlement involving pension will be severe, and she may even contest the D. Meanwhile he's doing everything to help her get tenure, and she will in all likelihood get it, which will be at least 3 years more to wait! My concern is that the longer a M lasts, the more issues with D, not to mention the unforeseeable problems. Is MM's "strategy" anywhere near reasonable? Comments sought and welcome!

His only strategy is to fool you. They always make up reasons: until the kids grow up, when the kids go to college, after her their b/days, after the surgery, after she gets a job... It's always after something, never before!

 

For the same excuse for which he wants to ewait three more years, he may decide to NOT divorce at all. If I were you, I would accept the fact that he will never divorce. In three years many things will change. His feelings for you won't be the same. You will be frustrated because of the whole situation and you'll argue more than not. You'll end up breking up before those 3 years pass.

 

Break up with him and tell him that you can't wait that long. Now that he told you, you know what to do. You'll date other people and if you're not in love with anyone after 3 years, you might give your MM another chance after he divorces his wife.

 

By the way, talk to a lawyer and check what he told you about the "severe" settlement. if you discover that the basis on which he built his excuse is fake, will you still trust him?

 

Whether she has a job or not doesn't make their joint property and marital assets bigger. She also won't get more or less if she has a job. If the law in your state imposes that marital assets are shared 50-50% then she will get 50% in either case. Moreover her finacial contribution may raise her share. The judge's logic is not: the wife didn't work so she deserves more. The only thing that would be different is alimony; he would most likely have to pay alimony until she gets a job. Also, if they have children, chiuld support would be bigger if she has custody but doesn't work.

 

He supports her financially anyway so I don't see how he would lose any money. Now he supports himself and her; if he lived with you, he would support himself and her, and YOU hopefully support yourself independently. If he really wanted to be with you, he would leave her. No money would stop him from being with the woman he loves.

 

But he has you without marrying you so this triangle suits him big time. If you want him to change something, YOU have to make it happen. Dump him! Deprive him from the benefits of having you in his life if he decides to stay with the wife. Only then you will make him do something, Are you not sure that he will leave? Then why would you wait for 3 years for a man who wouldn't leave for you?

[wtd]

Thanks for all your replies! You confirmed some of my worries and reminded me of things that might happen. I should have given more info in my initial post. The '+' is that there's no children. The '-' is that MM is many many years younger than W (60s). That perhaps helps give you a perspective why MM is doing everything he can to help her get tenure so she can have a stable and comfortable life in later years. For all I can see, MM is sincere that he is determined to D (think about their age difference). I believe he had lost interest in his M long before he met me. It's just a D decision needed a trigger. He never wore a wedding ring, by the way.

 

You will be frustrated because of the whole situation and you'll argue more than not. You'll end up breking up before those 3 years pass.

 

That is absolutely very possible to happen! I'm already starting feeling angry. I think that if one has made up his mind, he should act NOW.

 

You'll date other people and if you're not in love with anyone after 3 years, you might give your MM another chance after he divorces his wife.

 

Problem is, he's the only one I love :-( I'm also the kind of person that, once I break with anyone, I will NEVER go back to him. I strongly feel that if he doesn't D sooner for me, he's being selfish, and it's impossible for me to be a devoted spouse to such a man. Otherwise, I could be a 200% devoted, loving W! ;-)

 

By the way, talk to a lawyer and check what he told you about the "severe" settlement. if you discover that the basis on which he built his excuse is fake, will you still trust him?

 

That's exactly my wondering: Does it really make any difference whether W has tenure or not? Suppose that in one year it's already clear that she will surely get tenure, wouldn't that be enough? By the way, for clarification, she does have a very good job now, making about 70k. It's a relatively new job, and the tenure would secure her job permanently.

[norajane]

There's nothing HE can do to help her get tenure, unless he's doing her research and writing her papers for her and helping her get published. She has to do that on her own through teaching and publishing. So what is he saying that he's doing to help her get tenure???

 

BTW - most people who get divorced have jobs that are not guaranteed! Why would her not having a guaranteed job make any difference?

 

This is a long delay tactic and if you're already stressed about this, I don't see why or how you'd wait 3 more years.

[wtd]

There's nothing HE can do to help her get tenure, unless he's doing her research and writing her papers for her and helping her get published. She has to do that on her own through teaching and publishing. So what is he saying that he's doing to help her get tenure???

 

In fact, he has been adding her name to papers he wrote by himself on his own research. That's why I know she'll have no problem getting tenure. They are in the same field, but study very different branches. I dare say anyone who knows them both could tell she has no part in the papers and barely understands them.

 

That is another thing that is very upsetting to me: to see that he's helping HER in such outrageous way (almost "illegal", hehe), that SHE's the one that's benefitting so enormously from our R, while no change has happened in my life. I'm making them both happy, at least for now! :-(

[Guest]

You do realize that tenure is a very competitive process and very difficult to get, often taking a decade or more.

Most professors move from college to college seeking tenure and only a select handful receive it.

 

 

Most folks face "whether" MM will D, my problem is "when". I'm convinced MM is determined to D, however he wants to wait till W gets tenure (academic job guaranteed for life), because if D before she gets tenure, then financial settlement involving pension will be severe, and she may even contest the D. Meanwhile he's doing everything to help her get tenure, and she will in all likelihood get it, which will be at least 3 years more to wait! My concern is that the longer a M lasts, the more issues with D, not to mention the unforeseeable problems. Is MM's "strategy" anywhere near reasonable? Comments sought and welcome!

[pureinheart]

It could be a way to keep you wondering, and it worked for a time, but you are reaching out, not taking the full word of MM....that is soooo good. Ex-MM did that to me.....

[norajane]

In fact, he has been adding her name to papers he wrote by himself on his own research. That's why I know she'll have no problem getting tenure. They are in the same field, but study very different branches. I dare say anyone who knows them both could tell she has no part in the papers and barely understands them.

 

That is another thing that is very upsetting to me: to see that he's helping HER in such outrageous way (almost "illegal", hehe), that SHE's the one that's benefitting so enormously from our R, while no change has happened in my life. I'm making them both happy, at least for now! :-(

 

My, my. So he's another kind of liar and cheat on top of the whole affair with you.

 

Well, you have to consider that you are making it easier on him to stay in his marriage if he is so unhappy in it. Without you around, it might be harder for him to endure his misery since he wouldn't have you to turn to for some fun.

 

If I were you, I'd lose him fast and get on with my life. Waiting around for tenure is a long time waiting around and watching him do his "best" for his wife rather than for you.

[RecordProducer]

He never wore a wedding ring, by the way.

Hubby and I don't wear it either and love each other a lot. It doesn't mean anything.

 

 

Problem is, he's the only one I love :-( I'm also the kind of person that, once I break with anyone, I will NEVER go back to him.

I forgot to write that I thought it's what you should TELL HIM, not necessarily go back him.

 

There is no such thing as "he's the only one I love." You love him today, you can unlove him tomorrow. Haven't you loved before? I was crazy about my ex-husband and when he left me I wanted to die. A couple years later I was grateful for the divorce and now I am re-married. We love, get disappointed, and move on. Don't revolve your plans around the idea that he's the only one. Making him the center of the universe is not going to help you not only get him, but also keep him.

I strongly feel that if he doesn't D sooner for me, he's being selfish, and it's impossible for me to be a devoted spouse to such a man. Otherwise, I could be a 200% devoted, loving W! ;-)

I agree. But sometimes we need to push men to do the right thing. My husband happens to always do the right thing, but never at the right time. I have to lose 10 pounds persuading him that 1+1 is 2.

 

Don't be resentful and pessimistic. Have faith in his love and in the name of that faith, create a plan with the purpose of getting him. Break up with him and explain that this is not what you expected, therefore it's over. Men don't understand when you talk about feelings and when you're angry. When we dry out our pain and por our hearts to them, they think we're crazy bitches. They only understand the language of logic and solid arguments to confirm your attitudes.

 

Besides, they are so stupid. You can freely tell him that you don't want to be with him because he doesn't seem serious about your relationship then two days later hang up on him and tell him that you've moved on and don't want to hear from him. I've sen super-intelligent men fall for this trick, including my husband.

 

Be calm, firm, and friendly when breaking up with him. You can talk to a lawyer, too and have evidence of how realistic his fears about the settlement are.

 

If he loves you, he will leave his wife. If not, you don't need him.

 

 

 

 

That's exactly my wondering: Does it really make any difference whether W has tenure or not? Suppose that in one year it's already clear that she will surely get tenure, wouldn't that be enough? By the way, for clarification, she does have a very good job now, making about 70k. It's a relatively new job, and the tenure would secure her job permanently.

[pureinheart]

 

That is another thing that is very upsetting to me: to see that he's helping HER in such outrageous way (almost "illegal", hehe), that SHE's the one that's benefitting so enormously from our R, while no change has happened in my life. I'm making them both happy, at least for now! :-(

 

That is how I felt too....and not knowing the details of your R with MM, can only share my experiences:

 

Maybe at times I made the M better, although the M was bad long before I entered the picture....so thinking how could I really have made anything better. I think it was more the picture I had drawn for myself concerning their situation...glamourizing it so to speak....disfunction is disfunction no matter how you look at it.

 

The MM is in the middle of this triangle, going back in forth, sure they confide with us because we are in the lie with them. In my case exMM would take things out on me due to his home life, he was more subtle with me though, knowing I could walk. When we would fight I felt like he was talking to his W when yelling at me. I know he took things out on his W and was abusive, they were abusive to each other.

[Seen_It_All]

Why is the fact that she's 'much' older than him an issue NOW? It wasn't when he married her. Guess he had that Mrs. Robinson fantasy thing going back then, eh? But now that she's 60 it's not so 'hot' anymore for him, is that it?

 

So he's setting her up to dump her in 3 years, all the while leading her to believe they're going to grow old and eventually retire together, is that his plan?

 

What a prince.

 

And you're willing to wait for this parasite?

[RecordProducer]

Why is the fact that she's 'much' older than him an issue NOW? It wasn't when he married her. Guess he had that Mrs. Robinson fantasy thing going back then, eh? But now that she's 60 it's not so 'hot' anymore for him, is that it?

 

So he's setting her up to dump her in 3 years, all the while leading her to believe they're going to grow old and eventually retire together, is that his plan?

 

What a prince.

 

And you're willing to wait for this parasite?

Excellent point! And while we may accept that things, people, and feelings change, when I think of my husband who is 18 years older than I am, being with him for years and then dumping him for a younger guy when he is in his 60s would be awfully cruel. I am not judging the MM for falling in love with a younger woman, I am just stating that it IS a cruel destiny for anyone, in this case the wife. I am sure it's been her fear since forever and she might live through her nightmare soon.

 

It's very selfish to lead her on for 3 more years just so he does NOT give her more money. Even as an excuse it sounds horrible, not to mention if he really intends to ditch her in 3 years. It's not fair to anyone of you so the only conclusion I can make is that he is either trying to postpone the action that requires balls or is totally not intending to leave.

 

By the way, how much older than him is she?

[wtd]

Thank you everyone for your responses, especially to RecordProducer who gave some great advice.

 

Why is the fact that she's 'much' older than him an issue NOW? It wasn't when he married her. Guess he had that Mrs. Robinson fantasy thing going back then, eh? But now that she's 60 it's not so 'hot' anymore for him, is that it?

 

So he's setting her up to dump her in 3 years, all the while leading her to believe they're going to grow old and eventually retire together, is that his plan?

 

What a prince.

 

And you're willing to wait for this parasite?

 

Hi, appreciate your comments, but with all due respect, although I find his D strategy unacceptable, I don't find anything wrong with his D decision--that is NOT because I'm the OW, but even if I were an outsider I don't see there's anything terribly wrong in this case: love is unavailable in your marriage, so you decide to D and seek love where it's available. There's no children who will be hurt by your decision.

 

You do your best to endure reasonable support to W. What's wrong with that? It just so happened that W is much older than MM, but that is not the cause. Perhaps it would be more acceptable if an older H/W divorces a younger W/H, even if not for the lack of love. We are in 21st century, divorce is an option, and in a case such as this one, when both cannot be happy, the MM decides he's not going to be the one that will suffer. Life is never perfectly fair, and in this sense I don't see anything wrong. People are complex. In fact my MM is a very generous man and thats one reason I love him. I wouldn't have been around if he treated his W meanly. ;-)

[bonehead]

This whole situation sounds fishy.

[Guest]

This whole situation sounds fishy.

 

this whole situation is the reason why i would never have an affair if someone married. when i separated from the ex, i got the divorce papers done asap. i didn't wait around. if someone stalls, they are stringing u along - people that want u - don't play games and waste time. if i was married, fell in love with another, i would leave right then. anything else is unacceptable.

[NoIDidn't]

Yep, classic bait and switch.

 

Leave him. Make him put his money where his mouth is.

[frannie]

The '-' is that MM is many many years younger than W (60s). That perhaps helps give you a perspective why MM is doing everything he can to help her get tenure so she can have a stable and comfortable life in later years. For all I can see, MM is sincere that he is determined to D (think about their age difference).

 

Problem is, he's the only one I love :-( I'm also the kind of person that, once I break with anyone, I will NEVER go back to him. I strongly feel that if he doesn't D sooner for me, he's being selfish, and it's impossible for me to be a devoted spouse to such a man. Otherwise, I could be a 200% devoted, loving W! ;-)

 

I don't see any reason why an age difference should make it obvious that he's being 'sincere' in wanting a divorce. So she's older? So what?

 

The way you (or he) make it sound... it's like he can't wait to get rid of the pensioner and start a new life with a 200% devoted wife. And that all goes well til he's ready for a new, younger model or what? It all sounds too much like trading in cars

 

As for the 3 years thing. Well, if she's a professional woman with her own career and presumably brains of her own, why does he have to help to secure her tenure..? He's making her sound like someone not really up to the mark. Everything about this sounds nasty to me .

 

And this is coming from someone also involved in an affair... there seems something extra-specially not-right here and I can't exactly say what it is.

[RecordProducer]

Thank you everyone for your responses, especially to RecordProducer who gave some great advice.

You're welcome. I've learned the formula in my own and other women's experience: if a man doesn't want to commit to you on a higher level than the existent one, you dump him and he comes around if he loves you. If he doesn't, the woman is happy to be free from a man who didn't truly love her. I see this happening all the time.

 

although I find his D strategy unacceptable, I don't find anything wrong with his D decision

It's not the divorce that's a problem; you're right, people get divorced every day and that's fine most of the time, especially if two rersponsible adults don't make one another happy and there are no little children involved. It's that he is not making a heart decision, but a mind decision to waste three more years of his wife's life and your life, just so he can get more money.

 

He said the only reason was because the settlement would be "severe." What's severe mean? Unfair? Do you really think that the judge would be unfair and give his wife more than she deserves? No. He will divide the assets in the most fair way. But your guy doesn't want it to be fair; he wants more for himself. I don't see anything generous about it. And I don't see anything generous about wasting 3 years of two women's lives for his financial plans.

 

You do your best to endure reasonable support to W. What's wrong with that?

Making plans to dump your spouse after 3 years in order to lose less assets is a lousy way of showing support. If you were in his wife's shoes, would you appreciate it if you knew that he planned to divorce you, but kept leading you on for years for financial reasons? If you were in HIS shoes, would you think that money is more important than love and act the same?

 

You really need to talk to a lawyer about this. I am afraid that he is not gaining anything by waiting for three years. As Frannie said, the fact that she is much older is no warranty that he wil divorce her. As you see, love is not the most important thing to him. How much money he will lose seems important enough to waste 3 more years of his life. But he is not wasting them because you'll stick around all the time. But what if you don't? Only if he loses you, will you know whether money was more important to him than your love. What if he never divorces his wife for the very same reasons?

 

If he thinks the settlement will be more severe than in 3 yeras, then he will say that the settlement is more severe if he divorces her than if he doesn't! He will lose roughly half of all their assets. If they live in a nice house, he will get half of it only - the house that he has been working for for many years. If she didn't work then all their savings were collected through his working; and in the divorce process he will have to give up half of it. Are you sure that a man who calls this settlement "severe" will actually go through it? Why isn't he ready to go through it now? What gurantees you that he will?

 

Many men stay married because they don't want to lose half of everything and start from a scratch. It suits him to keep you on aside and not lose any penny. Talk to a lawyer and find out if he was just bullsh*tting you.

 

Life is never perfectly fair, and in this sense I don't see anything wrong. People are complex. In fact my MM is a very generous man and thats one reason I love him.

Because you love him, you're blind and can't think straight. Love does that to our minds, you're neither the first nor the last to be blinded by its power. Everyone of us has swallowed a bunch of lies in the name of love. But how you know that something is wrong is when it starts hurting. If you're OK with being the OW for the next few years and have faith that he WILL leave then there is nothing to discuss. But our faith needs proofs and solid basis to be built upon and I don't think you like this option one bit.

 

Are you sure he will leave in 3 years? It's a long period. Frankly, I am not 100% sure that anything in my life will be the same in 3 years. I think the way things go, I will still be married to my husband and love him, but can I really be 100% certain that nothing will change or that things will change in my favor?

 

Unfortunately "I will" is not good enough. It means "I will, but I am not."

"I did" is what counts and makes the difference.

 

I wouldn't have been around if he treated his W meanly.

It's mean to make wicked plans behind somebody's back. He is not waiting because of her, but because of HIM, according to his excuse. If everything is so clean and innocent then why is he still hiding and lying? OK, he fell in love with another woman, the heart needs love, we need to be happy. But now be a man about it and do the right thing.

[lasan]

I have been following this thread with great interest. One day (probably near the time of my death, seems like it is taking forever) I am going to be out of law school.

 

Even though what he is doing is nasty, it might be a valid reason to stay. Divorces should be 80% business and 20% emotional according to one of my teachers. She says that people get all wrapped up in emotions and don't take care of their financial affairs and then wonder why they got taken to the cleaners.

 

 

Whatever his reason is, if he loves you, He will leave for you no matter what happens.

[stillafool]

Wow, 3 years to wait. I don't know but it seems in 3 years he will come up with a new reason why he can't leave. His wife may be 60+ but she has a good job and may be very attractive. He is probably still having sex with her too. He was attracted to her enough to marry her. I can't see him sticking around in an unhappy marriage for 3 more years for his wife's benefit. Men who cheat are too selfish for that. How do you know you are not the first affair he's had on his wife?

 

I agree with others that something is definitely fishy about his story.

[whichwayisup]

Are you sure he will leave in 3 years? It's a long period. Frankly, I am not 100% sure that anything in my life will be the same in 3 years

 

Anything can happen in 3 years. What if she gets get sick, cancer or something, or if he gets cancer? What then? You think he will leave his whole life, his support from family, inlaws, close friends and his wife for someone else? I am sorry to come off as harsh, but when the chips are down - People turn to those they know they can 100% trust and know very well. Especially during a crisis.

 

Listen to RP, she has given you ALOT to think about.

 

If you are willing to hang in for 3 years, fine, do that - BUT in 3 years if he hasn't ended his marriage and gives you some bullcrap line about needing more time, You have more power and control over yourself than you think! Take the blinders off, take a step back and see this situation from another angle..Even pretend your situation is about a good friend of yours...What would you be telling her if she were in your shoes? Try this and see what you feel and think.

[bonehead]

Divorces should be 80% business and 20% emotional according to one of my teachers. She says that people get all wrapped up in emotions and don't take care of their financial affairs and then wonder why they got taken to the cleaners.

 

She is right.

 

A divorce ( On paper ) is pretty much the same as dissolving a corporation

[norajane]

3 years...and how will you feel about yourself 3 years from now? How will you feel after 3 years of sneaking around and only being able to call certain times and only being able to be with him at certain times in limited places, after 3 years of holidays that he's spending with her and not you, 3 years of nights alone when he's with her, 3 years of putting your well-being in second place to hers and his, 3 years of waiting and wishing...?