Are we too quick to label abusive behaviors??

[cutegirl]

Are most people too quick to label certain behaviours as abusive? From reading a lot of posts here on this board (in all the different forums) I think people are.

 

And I'm a female btw...

 

It's like almost everything is considered abusive nowadays, calling each other names is abusive, shoving is abuse, being somewhat controlling is abusive. I mean, what if some people grew up "ghetto style", like not from high-class families where everyone is super respectful and they just cuss a lot? Maybe that's just how some people talk? When I talk to some of my FEMALE FRIENDS, and I'm female btw too, I'll say stuff like :"What's up bitch?". Or "What are you doing slut?" lol Some people really grow up talking like this.

 

But other than that, I mean for example going from what people post here as guidelines for abusive behavior, then EVERYONE I know is in a somewhat abusive relationship, and I'm not kidding either. I don't have TONS of female friends, but ALL the ones I know are in abusive relationships going off from the criteria of "what is considered abuse."

 

For example, I have friend "A", whose bf forbids her from dressing to sexy and always accuses her of dressing like a whore and a slut and not showing him respect by the way she dresses. And he makes her buy him tons of cell phones and other stuff and makes her feel guilty when she doesn't want to... So I guess that's abusive.

 

And then I have know a girl "B" who spent 20k going in debt helpong her bf go to dental school and now that he graduated he's cheating. Plus he throws dishes on the floor when his food is not heated right and patronizes her when she cleans the floor and makes her run to get him new food etc I guess that's abuse too.

 

And then I know someone else, let's call her "C" who is married, and her husband is always hinting how he's sick of her because all she does is stay home and how he's getting sick of her... etc I guess that is abuse too?

 

I mean it's like everyone I know is in an "abusive" relationship if I'm going by the general accepted criteria of what constitutes an abusive relationship. I would dare say that from what I see then from my experience that there are MORE woman in abusive relationship than non-abusive.

 

I swear that I don't know of any couple in real life that don't have fights with name-calling, some shoving or throwing stuff around, or a relationship where one partner is always asking for money or mooching off the other person.

 

So is it fair to say than the majority of people in relationships are in abusive ones? Because I really can think of no one in my life that is in a relationship that doesn't have a few of these "signs of abuse".

[Craig]

Wow. Thank you for what appears to be a from the heart, honest and curious post.

 

Abuse is like cancer, it begins as a tiny dot so small you can not see it and slowly over time grows into a monster that eventually you have to deal with or die. The death of a person from abuse sometimes comes from the death of the physical body but mostly it comes as the death of who that person once was.

 

Abuse tends to get worse over time and that is why people can be so quick to suggest leaving someone that shows a tendency to abuse.

 

Power and control are the goals of an abuser but I think the reasons people abuse other people are not that simple and not easily or quickly corrected. Most of the time.

 

From my own experience I know there are people from all walks of life that are respectful or abusive

 

Cutegirl, we are in a transition period regarding what is considered acceptable behavior and the movement is towards a more aware society where abuse is not tolerated or pc. Once it was considered humorous to make fun of alcoholics but you don't see that too much now, once not that long ago it was considered ok for black comedians to use the "n" word but you see resistance mounting against that practice, etc.

 

I don't know if most relationships are abusive, I certainly hope not and that hasn't been my experience personally but I do believe that men and women abuse each other at roughly the same rate.

[Love Hurts]

People in a relationship that is abusive know first hand that it is.

In my personal experiences I have met many abused females.

Some bruised and battered repeatedly.

Along with; highly abusive language, screaming and mental tormentation on a daily basis.

 

Some of these females have attempted to take their own lives for the sake of seeing no other way out of their living hell.

These are not females on drugs or alcoholics they are clear minded individuals that snap under years of pressure and abuses.

I have seen first hand the females stalked by a crazed male. Beaten and threatened their possessions destroyed.

I have seen their fear and heard their cries for help.

 

Abuse is very real.

It sounds as if you can’t understand it or don’t get it because you are fortunate to have lived a protected from or sheltered life as of to date; Free from the uglies that abuse brings.

I hope you stay that way.

 

As for calling for money……….. A female with children and wondering where to and how to live in the aftermath… Needs money. As much as possible.

The law is set up to help her help herself and her children.

The legal system is not one sided ……… the majority of complaints against men come with police records supporting a history of him abusing his wife.

 

We know when someone is playing and when they are not.

It just feels different.

[norajane]

I swear that I don't know of any couple in real life that don't have fights with name-calling, some shoving or throwing stuff around, or a relationship where one partner is always asking for money or mooching off the other person.

 

So is it fair to say than the majority of people in relationships are in abusive ones? Because I really can think of no one in my life that is in a relationship that doesn't have a few of these "signs of abuse".

 

See, that's the problem when you grow up with abuse - you start to think it's normal behavior and perpetuate the problem in every relationship you have. It's not normal!

 

I did not grow up in an upper class family - far from it. My neighborhood is probably on some "beware all who enter" list. There was a lot of abuse going on around me.

 

However, my parents are immigrants, and though there may have been a lot of emotional yelling in the house, there was never any name-calling or "you're so stupid" or swearing at people. My parents have been faithful to each other for over 40 years, and they never hit each other or belittled each other. And I have never been in a relationship with a man who ever called me names, threw things around, or hit me. Nor are my friends in such relationships.

 

It is not fair to say the majority of people are in abusive relationships just because the people around you are in them.

 

You should have higher expectations for yourself than that.

[lindya]

Are most people too quick to label certain behaviours as abusive? From reading a lot of posts here on this board (in all the different forums) I think people are.

 

And I'm a female btw...

 

It's like almost everything is considered abusive nowadays, calling each other names is abusive, shoving is abuse, being somewhat controlling is abusive. I mean, what if some people grew up "ghetto style", like not from high-class families where everyone is super respectful and they just cuss a lot? Maybe that's just how some people talk? When I talk to some of my FEMALE FRIENDS, and I'm female btw too, I'll say stuff like :"What's up bitch?". Or "What are you doing slut?" lol Some people really grow up talking like this.

 

Certain things (name calling etc) will be shrugged off by some people but cause great offence and hurt to others. Persisting in a certain type of behaviour towards someone when you are well aware that it's causing them stress and discomfort is abusive.

 

Where does the line get drawn? I don't think there's any clear answer to that. People get short tempered and snappy sometimes...and human beings don't act ideally towards eachother 100% of the time. Some appreciation of that is essential for relative harmony to be possible the majority of the time...and I think we need to exercise a little caution in applying labels such as "abusive".

 

Beside me I have a newspaper detailing the story of a 5 year old boy in Maryland who was disciplined (by his school) for "sexual harassment" after pinching a female classmate's bottom. The item tells how four weeks previously a four year old in Texas who hugged a teaching assistant was suspended for "inappropriately touching her".

 

What to make of that? To me, it shows how people can become so tunnel visioned and obsessive in their quest to tackle abuse that they themselves become the perpetrators of witch-hunt style actions that are far more abusive and screwed up than the actions they seek to identify and punish. I mean...a five year old being labelled until middle school as a "sexual harasser" for pinching someone's bum? A four year old being punished for seeking affection from an adult? It's like something out of Oliver Twist!

 

Cutegirl, I thought some of the behaviours you described in your post did sound pretty abusive. For instance...

 

Plus he throws dishes on the floor when his food is not heated right and patronizes her when she cleans the floor and makes her run to get him new food etc I guess that's abuse too.

 

Yep. If a boyfriend treated me like that once I'd be insisting on a serious talk about our future. If it happened twice, I'd leave. Spending one's quality time with someone who shows you that amount of disrespect can't be very good for the soul or the self esteem.

 

In general, though, I think you raise interesting points about the problems inherent in people sometimes being overly quick to slap on the "abusive" label. Give a dog a bad name, etc....

[bonehead]

In the situations you posted about, its the repeating pattern more then the actions themselves.

[CardPlay3r]

Wow cute...you certainly had it tough in life...ok let's see about your scenarios...

 

First of all...being a female isn't that important in this regard, males can be abused by females as well...also, wealth hasn't much to do with it either, it happens in more wealthy families than you would think.

 

Maybe that's just how some people talk? When I talk to some of my FEMALE FRIENDS, and I'm female btw too, I'll say stuff like :"What's up bitch?". Or "What are you doing slut?"

 

Ok, there is a clear difference between talking, cussing in normal speak or in a jokingly way...noone is saying that is abuse.

 

For example, I have friend "A", whose bf forbids her from dressing to sexy and always accuses her of dressing like a whore and a slut and not showing him respect by the way she dresses. And he makes her buy him tons of cell phones and other stuff and makes her feel guilty when she doesn't want to... So I guess that's abusive.

 

Of course it is...look what you're saying. He is making her dress a certaing way, making her buy him stuff and treating her like crap by demeaning her all the time. We are talking about equal adults here, do you think he has the right to make A do stuff?

 

And then I have know a girl "B" who spent 20k going in debt helpong her bf go to dental school and now that he graduated he's cheating. Plus he throws dishes on the floor when his food is not heated right and patronizes her when she cleans the floor and makes her run to get him new food etc I guess that's abuse too.

 

What do you think? So, should the woman's role be to pay for her man's schooling, make him food which he has every right to throw on the floor and make her clean up if it's not 'heated' as he likes it, then make fun of her when she cleans it up and order her to go get more food?

 

And then I know someone else, let's call her "C" who is married, and her husband is always hinting how he's sick of her because all she does is stay home and how he's getting sick of her... etc I guess that is abuse too?

 

It is because if you have someone call you a slut, whore, sick etc. 10 times/day, it really messes with your head and you end up believing it. You can make the skinniest girl in the world believe she's obese that way etc. That's why it's called emotional abuse.

 

Look cutegirl...just take a step back and think about things. Do you think you should be equal in your relationship, or should you be a slave to the man...do stuff that he demands you doing, follow his commands, dress as he says etc. ?

 

That's what happening with the women you described there...I hope none of them is you, and you or them don't have to take that from anyone.

Be sure they hate it thoroughly no matter what act they put on or if they admit it or not.

[Walk]

I always go by the underlying message that is presented to tell if the person is being abused, or if the problem is one based in communication. Obviously I'm not a professional, and it's just my opinion, but it's how I decide if it's "abusive". Sometimes bad communication, assumptions, and irrational thoughts can cause really bad problems in relationship. Those can be worked on, resolved. Abuse can't. Not with any amount of success.

 

For example, I have friend "A", whose bf forbids her from dressing to sexy and always accuses her of dressing like a whore and a slut .......makes her feel guilty when she doesn't want to..

 

This says to me that the guy doesn't trust her. Feels he must control her dress in order to keep her. He has low self-esteem and resents her for making him feel that way. He "guilts" her into buying stuff in order to make her pay for making him feel like he's less. That doesn't equate to "healthy" in my book. He resents her, feels he deserve something in return for the horrible things she does to him. That isn't a communication problem, that's a mental problem on his part.

 

girl "B" who spent 20k going in debt helpong her bf go to dental school and now that he graduated he's cheating. Plus he throws dishes on the floor when his food is not heated right and patronizes her when she cleans the floor and makes her run to get him new food etc I guess that's abuse too.

 

Then I see this, and think.. here's a guy who doesn't even care about his gf. He's just there to get stuff from her. He doesn't care if he gives her a deadly STD. He doesn't even see her as human at this point. She's just a cash cow. So in his mind, it's okay to treat her as inhuman. To laugh at her while he trashes the dinner she made him. He feels it's ok to undermine her self-confidence, and self-worth. He see's her as "weak, he preys on it and feels contempt for her. But mostly, I think he feels contempt for himself, but he can't handle it, so he projects that contempt on to this girl.

 

Again, not healthy. He can't even admit what the problem is, let alone address it with her. And she holds no equality in his eyes in order to be able to "comprimise" with him anyway. She's less then him. She either accepts horrible treatment from him, or he leaves. She has such crap self-esteem that she'd rather be treated like crap then have him leave. It won't ever be a healthy relationship.

 

her "C" who is married, and her husband is always hinting how he's sick of her because all she does is stay home and how he's getting sick of her

 

This one is kind of iffy in my book. It's not very healthy, but depending on the "hinting" it may be frustration and not communicating effectively enough to get anything resolved. Or potentially, he has attempted to communicate clearly on several occasions and the woman doesn't respect him enough to attempt to find a happy comprimise with him. Kind of hard to tell from this example. I wouldn't jump to say it's "abusive" though.

 

I think you accept too much as "normal" behavior. I have a high tolerance level for what would be considered "abusive" language, but I also have a certain standard in which I wish to be treated. Its how I treat others also. If those standards are not met, then I can either figure out if things can change so that my standards are met... or they can't and I leave. But if I'm in a relationship where my mental health is degrading, my self-esteem is flat lining, and I'm struggling in vain to make things work... then I don't care if it's technically "abusive" or not.. I just don't want to be with someone who's going to make me feel like shyt. Life's too short.

[boshemia]

There are cultural standards that come into play, and certain groups whether regional, social, generational, or race is what decides that group it does make a difference.

 

I live in a small town, and things pass by here that wouldn't fly in any other place. The example mentioned above where a five year old child was punished for sexual harassment? In our local school my daughter and several other girls were being harassed by the same two boys. I mean harassed... In my daughters case in first grade the boy put his hands down her pants and touched her privates, pushed her up against the wall and put his tongue in her mouth, and other things like that. In fifth grade he was sitting in class and said hey look at this, she looked and he was unbuttoned and showed her a full view of his... The school did discipline him but only for one recess.

 

I finally told my daughter if he so much as touched her to drop his ass and I would be there to defend her, I told the school the same thing that was it, I had law enforcement on standby and next time it happened it would be criminal. It didn't happen again.

 

The school looked at me like I was one of "them new aged hippie type people" No kidding... they don't like me much. LOL... aww...

 

Here things like that are just chalked up to "boys being boys" we haven't had an arrest on a rape charge in five years, not one... I know of my report, and two others filed against the same man. Mine was witnessed by half of a party. Along with several other girls who haven't come forward publicly... guess how the cops treated it? "Boys will be boys..."

 

We are just a small town, less than 1000 people... that's how it goes here.

 

And at the same time I know that is an extreme example... but I also wanted to point out. I grew up thinking that my family was totally normal, I didn't know what the word abuse was... I think I was twelve when I told two other girls my age that I wasn't a virgin. When they asked about it I told them... I had been molested... to me that was totally normal. It still is...

 

I am more shocked to meet someone who hasn't been molested than someone who has. It never once occured to me before my sixteenth birthday that not everyone lost their virginity before the age of five...

 

I still couldn't call it abuse until I was well into adulthood...

 

Some of the people you mentioned, they might not realize that its abuse. I've even known a few couples who seemed to like life that way... if they weren't fighting, they werent happy.

 

Of those friends you mentioned... Are they happy? That's the real key... I didn't know it was abuse, but I wasn't happy. I hated myself, I hated my life... that's not a good thing, and that's not normal...

 

If they are happy... then god bless em...

[CardPlay3r]

Oh wow boshemia...so, you told the police exactly who raped you and they haven't taken evidence from him? that's plain criminal....don't let them get away with that, you can go higher to the fbi or something, or to the media.

 

Nobody is happy being abused, but it can be highly confusing especially in backwards communities/societies like you described

[boshemia]

Ohhh boy... long long long story. It finally took getting the media involved (our local newspaper avoided it like the plague) but I've heard from people that they saw it in places I never expected... after that feds came in and things are looking up.

[CardPlay3r]

Ohh that's great! really refreshing to see someone stand up for themselves against all the odds...maybe you should tell the story in a separate thread? might be good for you to let off some steam

 

And...I can't believe how backward some places still are, especially in the us which claims to be all about freedom and such - I bet that's what those people in your town say too, though they wouldn't lift a finger to do their job

[Craig]

Ohh that's great! really refreshing to see someone stand up for themselves against all the odds...maybe you should tell the story in a separate thread? might be good for you to let off some steam

If it's an on-going criminal investigation you don't want to air anything publicly about it just yet. I think your interests would be better served to remain quiet about the details until any trials are concluded.

 

BUT! Kudos to you boshemia! *extends handshake* I am so glad there are people like you who are willing to fight the good fight.

[boshemia]

If it's an on-going criminal investigation you don't want to air anything publicly about it just yet. I think your interests would be better served to remain quiet about the details until any trials are concluded

 

smiles... yes...

 

But my point was that some people seem to become so accustomed to seeing certain things that "boys will be boys" can happen in other forms. Well he only hit me once, can become he only hits me sometimes, to who knows...

 

I wasn't always able to stand up for myself and I have had the same idea that abuse didn't affect me, that was the really bad stuff. When a man beats a woman that's abuse...

 

Another thing I've noticed is that sometimes something can happen to us and it's not abuse, but the same thing happens to someone else and it is.

 

My counselor taught me something that helps. I often had trouble deciding what in my life might or might not be abuse... for me he used my kids, if you don't have kids you might have to find someone else that you love dearly and have a desire to protect from harm (your Mom, little sister or brother, best friend etc.)

 

He said that I should imagine sitting down with my child and having her tell me she is in the exact same situation. Sure Mom, he pushes me around sometimes but it's not like he actually hits me, or yeah so, he tells me I'm fat.. I really do need to lose weight. Then think about what I would tell her...

 

I sure as hell wouldn't say well honey, it's no big deal, that's just how some guys are. If you love him enough he'll change. Which is exactly what I would say to myself... but the thought of telling my daughter that made me sick.

 

It's a little bit os self counseling I guess, but it has worked very well...

[CardPlay3r]

It is amazing that you kept your sanity and can have such a good attitude..can't you leave that place and go to one with less ignorants in it?

 

Anyways cutegirl...you made this thread, you see everyone's opinion, why not come and post your thoughts on it?

[Craig]

It's a little bit of self counseling I guess, but it has worked very well...

Wow. I take my hat off to your counselor for coming up with such a simple way to put things in perspective. It's amazing what people will grow accustomed to and consider normal or not that big of a deal but if the same things were happening to a loved one we can see it for what it really is.