Treating shyness?

[Trystero]

I've had problems with shyness my entire life (I've posted about this before, as a few people might remember). I've been going to a psychologist the past six months or so, and I have yet to see a change. I'm still very isolated with few friends and no romantic attention whatsoever. I've heard something about medicinal treatments for social anxiety disorder (which it looks more and more like I have), but what research I've done wasn't too encouraging. Does anyone on here know more specifics about these medicines or other therapies that seem to work? Oh, and BTW, before someone suggests the cliche "you need to get out more and talk to people, etc." response, that doesn't seem to help in my case. Shyness and a low sense of self-worth seem embedded in my personality and do not go away with just social experience or normal therapy. Thanks in advance.

[Trystero]

Umm...does no one know or want to respond?

[magda]

Well, I think talking to your doctor about the medications would be good. One suggestion I have is just to put yourself out there, face your fears. I had a lot of luck taking an acting class at a community college, even though I was nervous about doing it - I imagined it being filled with theatre people who are all crazy confident, but most people were more or less like me. It was nice to try and be someone else, acting. First of all there's the difficulty of performing in front of the class, but it was a small class. After people got to know each other it got easier. It also taught you to kind of be someone else. If you can pretend you are smoeone else it can make it easier to do things. If you were the person you wish you were, how would you behave in a situation. Maybe this wuldn't help you but it helped me. I had difficulty doing presentations in front of groups and things like that until I took acting. You might think this suggestion is crap but it really helped me, not just presentations but I am a shy person. If you're at all intrigued, think about getting a book about acting from the library or something.

[JamesM]

From my personal experiences, I would have to say that shyness is a result or symptom of low self-esteem. Trying to medicate shyness will not solve the problem.

 

If I am not mistaken, antidepressants are used as a treatment. After a few weeks of pills, you feel better about life and hence about yourself. This is a good treatment. However, the concern becomes that the pill is what gives you confidence. If you forget a pill, then you feel alarmed and full of doubts. It is like the guy who hits homeruns only with his special bat. Yet when a new bat is exchanged without his knowledge he still hits homeruns. (No, it is not to be compared to the man who uses steroid pills to hit homeruns. ) It is all about the mind.

 

As simple as it sounds, the method is hard and yet so easy to accomplish: control your thoughts and pretend you are confident...and you shall be.

 

Back in my younger days (20 years ago),I learned this from experience. In high school, I was shy...one date. But when I reached college, I decided that these people do not know me. I can be what I want to be. So, I "faked" confidence. In reality, I became myself. Once I realized that I am no worse than other people...nor better...I began to realize that people are fun. Really. Instead of trying to make an impression, I began to learn about people and thier lives. It is amazing...people are really fascinating.

 

(That is part of my draw to LS...I find so many neat and fascinating people here. I am always wondering who next will PM me or become a new member).

 

Another personal example. I am still shy in a new setting most of the time. Not extremely shy, but I let my wife meet the people. I am never one to walk into a room and greet strangers. As I become adjusted, I am better. Yet this past weekend, I was a candid cameraman at a wedding. There was about 200 people. I went up to every person sitting at the tables and asked if I could take their picture. Strangely enough, the camera gave me confidence. And strangely enough, since I acted like myself, people responded with smiles and said yes. I was able to meet many new people and start conversatons. My wife said I was "working my magic." There is no way I could have gone up to them and started a conversation without the camera. It was all about forgetting me and focusing on them. (No pun intended).

 

And how might that apply to you?

 

First, develop confidence without pills for your longterm benefit. In the shortterm, the antidepressants can help, but if you stay on them too long, you will think that they ARE your self confidence.

 

Second, fake confidence, then you become confident. And yes, it really works. This gives the feeling that you can control new situations.

 

Third, focus on people and forget yourself. You are no different than others. Yes, many people are outgoing, but they have learned to be this way, because people respond to smiles and friendliness. Inside many of these people have more self doubts than you. They wonder if they are viewed as fat, skinny, short or a multitudes of other faults. I don't remember which one it was, but there are TV personalities who interview people regularly who have a difficult time meeting new people in their private life.

 

Fourth, keep up the counseling. It takes time. Work at the self confidence issue.

 

Fifth, find a prop. IOW, when I have a camera or a TV personality has a microphone, there is an issue of control. Yes, the camera gave me some power. Is there any situation that you can use that can help you build your confidence in dealing with people? Is there any area in life where you feel like you are "just as good as the next guy?"

 

As for meeting women, treat them as people. Become their friend. We men seem to think so often that women are intimidating. Yet if we meet them as friends with no concern how they think of us as men, we have zero problem with getting to know them. By getting to know a woman as a person who has need, desires, and problems, we begin to develop common ground and a friendship. This soon becomes love. If you try to make an impression, you worry too much about who YOU are. When you try to become a friend, you concentrate on what makes THEM tick. Big difference.

 

Life is great and can be fun. People are interesting and are always looking for friends. So, enjoy life and become a friend.

[Trystero]

From my personal experiences, I would have to say that shyness is a result or symptom of low self-esteem. Trying to medicate shyness will not solve the problem.

 

If I am not mistaken, antidepressants are used as a treatment. After a few weeks of pills, you feel better about life and hence about yourself. This is a good treatment. However, the concern becomes that the pill is what gives you confidence. If you forget a pill, then you feel alarmed and full of doubts. It is like the guy who hits homeruns only with his special bat. Yet when a new bat is exchanged without his knowledge he still hits homeruns. (No, it is not to be compared to the man who uses steroid pills to hit homeruns. ) It is all about the mind.

 

Actually, I was on two different kinds of anti-depressants for several months, with no appreciable result (including Prozac, which is one of the drugs mentioned for the treatment of social anxiety on Wikipedia). And I appreciate the advice, I really do, but I don't think anyone quite understands what I'm going through. It's not just a "get-out-more-and-fake-confidence-and-you'll-feel-better-about-yourself" situation. I have a mental block about talking to others without invitation; I can't make small talk, and I can't think of myself as the object of someone else's affection. Even though it defies reason, it's quite embedded in my personality and thinking, without much hope of dislodging it by normal methods.

[JamesM]

but I don't think anyone quite understands what I'm going through.

 

True, you are a unique individual. However, there are many who have been as shy as you who are no longer. We all assume we are the only ones who have it like we do, but we aren't.

 

I have a mental block about talking to others without invitation; I can't make small talk, and I can't think of myself as the object of someone else's affection.

 

This mental block is something you have built. And it is something that ONLY you can tear down. When you decide that you can talk to others...you will. I know that isn't going to make you happy, nor do I think you believe me, but the fact of the matter is that the block is as you say, mental...not physical.

 

Even though it defies reason, it's quite embedded in my personality and thinking, without much hope of dislodging it by normal methods.

 

Hate to say it, but you are correct. There is no hope of dislodging this mental block if you do not dislodge it. Drugs and therapy are tools and no more. A hammer cannot build a house, but a carpenter using the hammer can.

 

I can give examples til I am blue in the face, but until you apply those examples to you...there will be no change.

 

Personally, I have dealt many times with low self esteem, depression, and obsessive thoughts. I alwasy thought that I was unique...no one else had what I had. Then I read a book about OCD...hey, I had some of those symptoms! How can I apply this to me? I did, and it helped tremedously. Those tools still come in handy when I need them..And low self esteem has been with me many times. When I begin focusing on others and "pretending" that I am not so much lower than others, I begin to see a little clearer and realize that my pretenses are true.

 

For me, reading has helped the most. Trystero, answers are at your fingertips. Many, many people have been in your shoes. Some have discovered answers to their problems, because they believed it possible. Others have not, because they felt they were odd and beyond help. You and I have a choice....no one can make it for us.

[Slooop]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradoxical_intention

 

Frankl used this method on his patients which seems fitted to your situation. He would tell them to focus all their energies on intentionally trying to act out and exaggerate whatever mental blockage was hampering them. (In your case, focusing all your energy on acting exceptionally shy.) Eventually most of his patients found that the blockage was indeed mental and they were able to dispel it. The evidence he gives seemed anecdotal to me, and I've never actually tried it, but it's one more weapon to add to your arsenal against overcoming shyness.

[monkey00]

And I appreciate the advice, I really do, but I don't think anyone quite understands what I'm going through. It's not just a "get-out-more-and-fake-confidence-and-you'll-feel-better-about-yourself" situation. I have a mental block about talking to others without invitation; I can't make small talk, and I can't think of myself as the object of someone else's affection. Even though it defies reason, it's quite embedded in my personality and thinking, without much hope of dislodging it by normal methods.

 

What youre saying makes sense. I used to be a shy kid myself, i dont remember if it was due to low self-esteem but i know for sure i wasnt much of a socializer.

 

First off i agree with the others, it is very much about "get out more, and fake it till you make it". it doesnt matter if you feel bad about yourself or your 'mental block'. Whether you say something that you think sounds dumb, may not be at all...But the worst thing you can do is to put yourself down for saying such a thing - In this effect you're mentally conditioning yourself to avoid socializing.

 

Small talk isnt so bad when you get the hang of it. Read the news, stay up to date with current events/gadgets/etc. Show interest in what someone is wearing that looks unique. Tell your friend about something funny that happened to you yesterday.

Conversations are back and forth, you tell and listen and so shall the other person. I'd say as long as you arent insulting someone or speaking to them in a condescending way, you should be in the clear. It's ok to disagree or agree with someone.

 

In essence, the fake it till you make it does work, it took my a few years but i was able to break out of my shell and be comfortable with myself in the end.

The key is to stay as open-minded as possible, if you're arrogant about change you wont receive it. If you get invited to a social outting, and you're debating over staying home or going out with people (with the fear of being rejected)...GO OUT WITH THEM AND PRACTICE SOCIALIZING! ...what doesnt kill you makes you stronger.

 

I happen to have a friend who suffers from some form of social anxiety, he goes to therapy often and even takes medication...quite frankly none of it has helped him. The reason for that is he stays home all the time, refusing to try new things and meeting people.

 

Your mind can be your poison or your best friend. you have a choice.

 

Try doing a forum search on 'social anxiety' if you get a chance also.

[Ersatzteile]

Trystero:

 

Shyness is very probably genetic or a combination of genetics and upbringing.... there is nothing wrong with you, you just feel out of step way more often than extroverted people do. Unfortunately we live in a world where introverts are not valued... especially when they are younger.

 

It is OK to be introverted. It is normal to feel bad about being introverted because extroverts are incapable of understanding that you do not gain energy from interacting with other people, like they do. (Even though they are kind, and want to be helpful, they don't really understand... and that is OK) On the contrary -- interacting with others probably takes AWAY your energy. Extroverts do not understand this and it is very hard to explain it to them (and usually socially impossible to explain it to them).

And they don't understand that "Fake it till you make it" usually doesn't really work. "Practicing" being social usually makes very little dent in introverted people. It is not a magic bullet. Sorry. That doesn't mean you shouldn't put in your time at social functions, but it's just not a magic bullet. That's a myth.

 

On the other hand, an introvert GAINS energy from solitude (or reading, art, or other solitary pursuits) so that's how you re-fuel for your next social encounter. (Meanwhile, some extroverts truly dread being alone because being alone saps their energy... and introverts have trouble understanding that!) The more inner energy you have, the better you will do with social encounters.

 

I recently had a really draining experience at a lunch with co-workers and I was surprised because I have handled "girls day out" lunches pretty well for years... but this day I was just tired, didn't really want to be there, and listening to their conversation sapped my energy, and to make matters worse, one of the more extroverted in the group decided to make an issue of my being quiet. (There is always one extrovert who seems to like to poke quiet people with a stick.) which sapped my emotional energy even more. Unfortunately this day out was pre arranged and I wasn't able to predict if I would be tired and unsocial that day. That's a tough break but you have to rebound from it and not hold it against people or yourself.

 

Also: A big issue that many introverts have is that they have spent so much time alone, that they really don't find other people all that interesting sometimes. If you have spent your free time reading interesting books, listening to non-popular music and learning about fascinating subjects...because THOSE are what give you energy... let's face it, chances are you are not going to have anything to talk about with a crowd of "un-shy" people who spend more time engaged in traditional social pursuits . You won't have much in common with them even on a good day, hence difficulty with small talk. (And yes- small talk is dumb, there is no way around that. It's awkward and artificial and unfortunately silly. My advice-- if you find small talk really dumb and unnatural... TALK ABOUT THE WEATHER. Talking about weather is universal small talk and everyone knows it and everyone hates it just like you, so you don't have to feel so alone.)

 

Some other good small talk... and more honest... an example is:

 

(at Super Bowl time) "I have to admit, I don't watch football at all. Who should I be betting on?" Most people will LOVE to indoctrinate you with their favorite team. Voila, they are doing the talking.

 

Pretending you are something you are not, is usually a huge waste of your limited energy. Better to play dumb and let someone "educate" you.

 

Oh, and another secret: Many people are really not interested in getting to know new people. Many seemingly extroverted people are really only interested in drifting from clique to clique with minimal exposure to new things or people outside of their limited experience. So if you feel ignored or rejected, it isn't always because you've "failed to engage." It may be because some people just don't WANT to engage with someone different from the mainstream (i.e., you). They just want to engage with people like them (other soccer moms, other tech geeks, other bar hoppers, etc).

 

So, don't feel so bad. Maintain your energy level, keep your chin up, make a little bit of effort once in a while (do not bash yourself against a brick wall), and things WILL get better.

[Trystero]

Well, any progress I made with my therapist is pretty much a moot point at this juncture: he told me today that he didn't think it would be ethical for us to continue, since nothing he did seemed to have any major effect on me. I tried to steer him toward cognitive-behavioral therapy, but he didn't seem to think that would help. Actually, he seemed so result-oriented that he really didn't do much therapy. It's left me even more depressed than I was. Then again, I've been seriously contemplating suicide lately, so I don't know if I could feel much lower about myself. Any suggestions? Don't mention therapy unless you have something different that might actually help; it seemed like the six months I went through were a waste of time and money.

[JamesM]

Many people have found a therapist who didn't "click" or help. Then they look and find another one and...voila! They find success and big improvements in theie lives. My wife is one of those who found that the second therapist was much better for her.

 

I suggest that you find a different therapist. You may be surprised at how your life may change.

[Toni_no12002]

Hi,

When i was at school i used to be extremely shy.I just wouldnt know what to say to anyone.I remember that no one would sit next to me in class.I thought it was because they didnt like me.(it was a vicious circle themore no one sat next to me or tried talking to me the worse i felt and the shyer i got)

 

When i left school i had a label.I was the quiet one.It annoyed me.I started college.I remember i vowed not to be labelled shy again.I made myself do a course wich required me to be confident.I did hair and beauty.I went with a friend so i didnt feel so alone.I remember i was so scared at first.I didnt know what to say to people.I read something on body language also.I realised that most people didnt want to talk to me because of the way my body language was.Crossed arms, crossed legs.I tried to open myself up abit more and found that people talked to me.It took some time.When i left college i wasnt the shy one anymore.I had to talk to clients and talk to my colleagues.I forced myself to do it.It was embarrasing at first but now im completley different.You cant shut me up.Im a much happier person now and really enjoy talking to people.

 

I have loads more confidence now.People want to sit next to me,they want to talk to me.When i look back at how shy i was i cant believe i didnt help myself quicker.Back then that wasnt me.I was like an empty shell.

 

Maybe if you set yourself little goals to do everyday.You need to push yourself abit because otherwise you will only end up going backwards.

 

If you need anymore help feel free to pm me ill be glad to help!