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dropdeadlegs

OOD,

 

I have just read this entire thread and I honestly don't know how you stay, no matter the reasons, in a situation that has caused so much pain, and continues to cause pain and suspicion. I couldn't do it. I couldn't ever forgive serial cheating, no matter how much love I had for him or what my family's situation was. You have mentioned a few things that are ONE of the reasons you stay, but I can't imagine what reason, or combination of reasons could keep me there.

 

But, I'm not here to point that out and mean you absolutely no harm. You may remember that I helped you out with your paging on a cell phone thread.

 

What I do want to offer is that sexual deviations are one of the hardest psychological problems to overcome and there is a very small percentage of fairy tale endings and true recovery. No, I am not a professional, this is just what a professional told me. No, not every cheating spouse is a sexual deviant, but a sex addict, a man who not only cheats on his spouse but cheats on his additional lovers, well, that sounds sexually deviant to me. It seems there is too much pleasure in the acts of cheating, the thrill of sneaking around, and the possibility of being caught. His "main OW" as you refer to her is almost as much of a victim of him as you are. If he is a true sex addict, I think he needs a lot more than SA meetings can do for him, and it is pretty apparent that those meetings aren't helping him much.

 

It sounds from your posts that your family is fairly wealthy. Many states have adultery clauses within divorce law, even in no-fault divorce states. I think you would come out financially better than those dealing with irreconcilable differences. I'm sure you know your rights as you have consulted an attorney. Personally, I would make him pay through the testicles and get on with my life. Your love for him cannot cure his disease, or I should say that I don't BELIEVE it can. Get whatever proof you need, and love yourself enough SOON to do what eventually will have to be done. That is, unless you one day accept the behavior, as some women find a way to do, although many experience much emotional pain with that decision.

 

I know you are dealing with a medical crisis, but it sure seems like you'd have one less monkey on your back, and a pretty big one at that, with this situation resolved. You have quite a bit more strength and POWER than you know. All of this stress is bound to be taking far more of a toll on you than a full on assault (divorce) would. Divorce is NOT the end of the world. It's not easy, but it can be overcome.

 

I wish you the strength to solve one of your problems. I'm sorry to another post indicating you should leave, but there is strength in numbers. I hope that TODAY will be your final breaking point so you don't have to suffer for one more moment. I do not mean to put you on the defensive at all, I simply wish I could give you whatever it is that you need in order to end your pain.

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Hi OOD

 

First of all I am feeling sorry for what you are going through.

 

I do agree with some of the posters - you need something for a change. But if hiring an PI isn't an option for you, as you have not decided yet what you want to do with what you will be presented, then I suggest the first step is to go back and read what LJ used to post to you in another forum. This is the time for you to focus on yourself instead of your husband and his (possible) affairs. I would give you kudos on changing his routines - not for the sake of you successfully stopping him from contacting his OWs who you don't even know existed; but for the sake of you two enjoying a nice talk and a romantic dinner after a day of stress at work.

 

If we go back to the basic of dating - it's about the excitement, the butterflies in the stomach feelings, the mind-blowing sex; not the routines, the predictability, the responsibilities. Surprise him like the way any OW would have done! Hold his hands and kiss him in public; kiss him on his forehead when he feels vulnerable; reach out and touch his pot belly, telling him that you love his pot belly more than anything in the world; shower him with little gifts and write him cards (naughty ones - hide them somewhere in his suitcase so he will find them when he unpacks in the hotel) your advantage is that you do all this with his money and you will enjoy it. It sounds like puppy love but men are basically a kid in heart!

 

Then the next thing is to focus on your own business. Discuss with him about your business that he will invest heavily in. While your kids are going away for schools or for whatever reasons, you have something to be busy with, something that you both spend effort on, something that cost him money and he would be expecting returns after he got retired.... he wouldn't leave you for any OWs in the future because he has invested so much. Even if he would, you won't be afraid. You have something to hold on to. You can live without him.

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IfWishesWereHorses
That's possible. If he is doing that, he's a complete idiot to go through THIS MUCH LYING and SNEAKING AROUND. I guess I don't understand why he'd do this again, knowing how suspicious OOD is. He can see what he is doing to her, so why the F would he be doing this to her?? Just blows my mind!

 

BECAUSE IT FILLS HIM UP!!!! It is just like the way and alcoholic will ruin his life and loose everything even though he knows its happening to him. HE CONSIDERS OTHER PEOPLE AS EXTENTIONS OF HIMSELF, ONLY THERE TO SERVE HIS PURPOSE. The sexual escapades fill him up because he is noone without someone to desire or idolize him. He is an emotionally empty shell and he has to fill that shell everyday. He can't do it from within. It isn't about her or his kids, IN HIS MIND THEY EXIST ONLY TO PLAY THE PART OF HIS FAMILY. Men who are serial cheaters who go to lenghts to put on the perfect family man hat and good guy hat (these are filler uppers as well) will never be capable of loving anyone as most of us know unselfish love.

 

OOD bringing inconsistancies to his attention shatters the illusion that he needs to survive and he HAS to fight for that because that is all he is. HE HAS TO HAVE WHAT HE WANTS. He can recreate himself every day or every week. Never has to deal with the real him. Sure he loves to travel, looking into her eyes is nothing more to him than a reminder of the monster that he is. How could he do this to her???? Because he isn't completely human, never will be in my opinion, though I hope for her she gets what ever she dreams of.

 

DDLegs very nice post, and I understand exactly where your heart and head are, BUT when you talk about them being wealthy you aren't completely understanding that wealthy men generally have strong political connections, they have spent their entire careers getting to the center of the "good ole boy" network and have many allies and favors owed. Infact, this kind of thing is expected and taken care of as such. Its as incomprehensible to me as someones ability to continue to betray someone for their own pleasure or plan but a reality nonetheless.

 

OOD, my disclaimer is that my post isn't directed to your H as much as mice in general who engage in this type of behavior. Kinda my personal rant for the evening.

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dropdeadlegs
BECAUSE IT FILLS HIM UP!!!! It is just like the way and alcoholic will ruin his life and loose everything even though he knows its happening to him. HE CONSIDERS OTHER PEOPLE AS EXTENTIONS OF HIMSELF, ONLY THERE TO SERVE HIS PURPOSE. The sexual escapades fill him up because he is noone without someone to desire or idolize him. He is an emotionally empty shell and he has to fill that shell everyday. He can't do it from within. It isn't about her or his kids, IN HIS MIND THEY EXIST ONLY TO PLAY THE PART OF HIS FAMILY. Men who are serial cheaters who go to lenghts to put on the perfect family man hat and good guy hat (these are filler uppers as well) will never be capable of loving anyone as most of us know unselfish love.

 

OOD bringing inconsistancies to his attention shatters the illusion that he needs to survive and he HAS to fight for that because that is all he is. HE HAS TO HAVE WHAT HE WANTS. He can recreate himself every day or every week. Never has to deal with the real him. Sure he loves to travel, looking into her eyes is nothing more to him than a reminder of the monster that he is. How could he do this to her???? Because he isn't completely human, never will be in my opinion, though I hope for her she gets what ever she dreams of.

 

DDLegs very nice post, and I understand exactly where your heart and head are, BUT when you talk about them being wealthy you aren't completely understanding that wealthy men generally have strong political connections, they have spent their entire careers getting to the center of the "good ole boy" network and have many allies and favors owed. Infact, this kind of thing is expected and taken care of as such. Its as incomprehensible to me as someones ability to continue to betray someone for their own pleasure or plan but a reality nonetheless.

 

OOD, my disclaimer is that my post isn't directed to your H as much as mice in general who engage in this type of behavior. Kinda my personal rant for the evening.

You know, the first two paragraphs of the quoted post are what I perceive to be the difficulties, in a nutshell, of what I was talking about when I referred to dealing with serious sexually related psychological problems. Yes, my heart is in the right place. I want OOD to stop reeling from the pain. At least one form of her pain.

 

I don't know much of this story other than what I have read on this thread, and that took a long time to read! It was obvious to me that it is much more involved than what has been posted on this thread alone.

 

Still, I guess I have trouble understanding how remaining in a life that is tearing one apart emotionally could be worse than the worst alternative. As someone who is poor enough to qualify for some public assistance (like reduced lunches at school,) I cannot imagine any amount of money that could make me stay in a situation that is miserable. Political ties? Certainly those cannot put OOD in the poorhouse. As someone who has spent much of life in the proverbial poorhouse, there can be happiness there. No, my daughter doesn't have a car at 18, but she has a job and we are working on it. No we don't have everything we want, but we do have everything we need. What we lack in possessions we more than make up for in happiness. I couldn't put a price on that. Sleeping at night, and sleeping well, is priceless.

 

I suppose we all make our choices in our circumstances. I just hope that some reading don't lose sight that there are always choices and that no amount of money or community respect can take the place of emotional well being. Maybe I've got it all wrong but this marriage seems to be literally killing OOD and driving her insane. I only wish for her to find a fraction of the happiness that I have every day. Actually I wish she could feel ALL the happiness I feel.

 

Above all else I wish for her son to be healthy, as that would lift the world off of her shoulders. I am so sorry for the trauma you must be going through, OOD. I cannot imagine the difficulty you face every day. My thoughts are certainly with you all.

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:confused: I read to about post # 27 and just stopped.

 

You have a serial cheater who ( may ) or may not be cheating.

 

I have a few questions :

 

Why would you stay with someone who could not keep his jeans zipped around other women ?

 

To stay shows you must not respect yourself that much. ( Sorry but if it were me no matter how much I thought I loved him ) I would have ended it along time ago.

 

A GPS system. This shows a serious lack of trust. You dont seem to have the components of a good relationship. There is no trust , there is no communication ie ; possible deceit. and no respect for your feelings if he is climbing into the bed of another women.

 

What do you really have here ? : A GPS tracking system. A husband that lied to you. A husband likely depositing his DNA inside other women.

 

You may also have a repentant husband who is doing nothing behind your back and from past cheating issues you no longer trust him.

 

This is a recipe for a doomed relationship.

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Trialbyfire
:confused: I read to about post # 27 and just stopped.

 

You have a serial cheater who ( may ) or may not be cheating.

 

I have a few questions :

 

Why would you stay with someone who could not keep his jeans zipped around other women ?

 

To stay shows you must not respect yourself that much. ( Sorry but if it were me no matter how much I thought I loved him ) I would have ended it along time ago.

 

A GPS system. This shows a serious lack of trust. You dont seem to have the components of a good relationship. There is no trust , there is no communication ie ; possible deceit. and no respect for your feelings if he is climbing into the bed of another women.

 

What do you really have here ? : A GPS tracking system. A husband that lied to you. A husband likely depositing his DNA inside other women.

 

You may also have a repentant husband who is doing nothing behind your back and from past cheating issues you no longer trust him.

 

This is a recipe for a doomed relationship.

They have a son who's in some form of medical condition/trauma right now...

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They have a son who's in some form of medical condition/trauma right now...

 

I feel very deeply sorry for the medical conditions of her son but does that make her husband acheive a green light to continue screwing around with other women. ?

 

I don't get it.

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IfWishesWereHorses

DDL,

 

I can tell you that I don't believe that for a minute this is about money or finacially surviving to her not at this point anyway. Its about loosing everything that you have wanted, worked for, created, and cherished (the family unit). There is a hope there and she can't give up on her family nor herself right now. YES, it is driving her batty but its a small sacrifice if she can just figure out how to fix the situation. Good grief, her life has been about making sure everyone else is happy, she, I imagine, doesn't have a clue where to start to make OOD happy or probably even who she wants to be. I think different personality types probably handle things very differently but I don't think she's ready to give up fighting for her life.

 

You are bang on about there being no monetary value that could be placed on emotional well-being but she has the potential for that everyday, no matter what the circumstances. You talked about your financial status but said it mattered not because you where happy. The same situation could send someone who had never had to learn to deal with/around it into a panic attack! But you have learned place importance on what MAKES you happy. That's were the good old "nobody can take this away from me" feeling that you want for her comes from. That's not dependent on other people, its completely self imposed. It's the gift I strive to give myself everyday, some days better than others! I believe she needs to acheive this FIRST, then what ever decision will not be so hard on her.

 

Her reaction to his misbehavior is a hard cycle to break once you get into it. But at some point she will have had enough. " Good God, look what I've let myself become, I HAVE to fix THIS, and it happens to be the ONE thing I CAN fix." It comes from emotionally letting go, and that's hard to do with 20 years invested.

 

OOD, I have completely hijacked your thread, sorry!:eek::love:

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Trialbyfire
I feel very deeply sorry for the medical conditions of her son but does that make her husband acheive a green light to continue screwing around with other women. ?

 

I don't get it.

No, this is what she's attempting to juggle while juggling the issue with her son. It's not always so clearcut and easy.

 

It was an easy decision for me because I have no children to worry about.

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First, I just want to offer OOD my hugs and encouragement.

 

Second, I would like to say that I ended my marriage when my children were under the age of 4. The ex was completely uninvolved for about 7 months after and is now barely involved (financially, emotionally or any other way). After about the first 3 or 4 months of transition time, my life actually got easier once I lost the heavy baggage that was an unworkable marriage.

 

I don't know your marriage OOD. Maybe it is workable, maybe it is not. But I will tell you that being "on your own" is not the same thing as being "alone." And when you're ready, you're going to surprise yourself with how much better life can be.

 

And don't worry. One day soon I'm going to take my own advice here. ;)

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outofdarkness
does your bill show text messaging?

 

look closer - he's got something going that you are not seeing right now....

 

put one of those voice activated recorders in his car that look like a pen or a lighter (he smokes).

 

hang tough. i know it's not easy! been there - done that... you are NOT crazy - his actions and attitude = guilty without remorse... which spells nothin but you being screwed.

 

((((( hugs)))))):(

Just got one, will do that...when he returns from being out of town.

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outofdarkness
Then call them and ask them to make it show incoming call details, and if they don't, change carriers.

They will not show incoming call details and he will not switch..tried that..

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outofdarkness
I have admitted on this forum before that my current husband and I got together while we were both still married. (I will add that both of us were at the ends of our respective ropes and ready to leave, he moved out within 6 weeks and I moved out -into my own separate home - as soon as the school year was over).

 

In any case, there was a period of "sneaking around". We both decided to not add insult to injury by letting our respective spouses know we were seeing each other. So, during those 6 weeks he lived with his then wife, he would call me while running out to get milk or sneak into the basement. For my part, I was very reluctant to take chances and called while my exhusband was out, but I do recall making a few calls while smoking outside.

 

So, OOD, I think you have reason to worry. Especially since a person who wanted to check work calls would likely do it inside, wherea pen and notepad are handy, not outside in the dark. Perhaps evading you has become a game? Part of the thrill of the affair?

 

In any case, you spend so much of your emotional energy jumping at these shadows (real) or ghosts (imagined) that I too believe you need to hire a PI to satisfy yourself once and for all. I know that in the past you have said that you feel afraid of what may be learned, but you are in such a tortured limbo now that it seems to me that you will never be able to move beyond this until you have certainty.

Yes, it was the sneaking around in the dark that bothered me..If he needs to check v mail, do it in the house, in the light on the land line?

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outofdarkness
WWIU -

 

he probably has a back up cell phone that he hides - one of those pay as you go kind of phones... so she can't see who he's calling...

If he's got a prepaid cell phone in his car, I'm missing it b/c I have been through everything.

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outofdarkness
That's possible. If he is doing that, he's a complete idiot to go through THIS MUCH LYING and SNEAKING AROUND. I guess I don't understand why he'd do this again, knowing how suspicious OOD is. He can see what he is doing to her, so why the F would he be doing this to her?? Just blows my mind!

B/C of the thrill of sneaking around, b/c he's angry w/ me for being here in his way, b/c he's in love w/ someone?? IDK

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outofdarkness
He is messing with her head..

 

You won't find any trails.. he has covered them up ..

 

I'm doing role reversal here.. Your husband is getting off on pulling your chain...

He figures WTF.. I'm cheating on her and she won't leave me alone so guess what.. she is gonna go thru tons of extra labor figuring this out..

 

Role reversal ...

 

You need to use another method of trying to catch him because this one isn't going to reap anything but you being driven up the wall :)

 

Hire a PI..

I agree, it's really hard to outsmart him..He's an expert and an addict

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outofdarkness
Ok, I'm not sure about this BUT it may be phone tag between him and someone...like someone called and left a message and he called them back and got their voicemail etc...and they kept missing each other...

 

I don't want to make you anxious, but it does sound fishy...the poster who said that if he was calling work, he would do so in the house, had a pretty good point...Sorry you're pulled in so many directions...

 

(((HUGS)))

Yes, phone tag..games..that is what I was thinking.

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outofdarkness
OOD,

 

I have just read this entire thread and I honestly don't know how you stay, no matter the reasons, in a situation that has caused so much pain, and continues to cause pain and suspicion. I couldn't do it. I couldn't ever forgive serial cheating, no matter how much love I had for him or what my family's situation was. You have mentioned a few things that are ONE of the reasons you stay, but I can't imagine what reason, or combination of reasons could keep me there.

 

But, I'm not here to point that out and mean you absolutely no harm. You may remember that I helped you out with your paging on a cell phone thread.

 

What I do want to offer is that sexual deviations are one of the hardest psychological problems to overcome and there is a very small percentage of fairy tale endings and true recovery. No, I am not a professional, this is just what a professional told me. No, not every cheating spouse is a sexual deviant, but a sex addict, a man who not only cheats on his spouse but cheats on his additional lovers, well, that sounds sexually deviant to me. It seems there is too much pleasure in the acts of cheating, the thrill of sneaking around, and the possibility of being caught. His "main OW" as you refer to her is almost as much of a victim of him as you are. If he is a true sex addict, I think he needs a lot more than SA meetings can do for him, and it is pretty apparent that those meetings aren't helping him much.

 

It sounds from your posts that your family is fairly wealthy. NO...my myself and my family are NOT wealthy..MY H"S family is very wealthy, but they hardly speak to us.. Many states have adultery clauses within divorce law, even in no-fault divorce states. I think you would come out financially better than those dealing with irreconcilable differences. I'm sure you know your rights as you have consulted an attorney. I actually filed for D two years ago, so yes, I am very informed..Personally, I would make him pay through the testicles and get on with my life. Your love for him cannot cure his disease, or I should say that I don't BELIEVE it can. Get whatever proof you need, and love yourself enough SOON to do what eventually will have to be done. That is, unless you one day accept the behavior, as some women find a way to do, although many experience much emotional pain with that decision.

I know you are dealing with a medical crisis, but it sure seems like you'd have one less monkey on your back, and a pretty big one at that, with this situation resolved. You have quite a bit more strength and POWER than you know. All of this stress is bound to be taking far more of a toll on you than a full on assault (divorce) would. Divorce is NOT the end of the world. It's not easy, but it can be overcome. Yes, I do have a son who is ill and do not want to make it worst for him or make him sicker then he already is...Yes, I am well aware that D is not the end of the world.

 

I wish you the strength to solve one of your problems. I'm sorry to another post indicating you should leave, but there is strength in numbers. I hope that TODAY will be your final breaking point so you don't have to suffer for one more moment. I do not mean to put you on the defensive at all, I simply wish I could give you whatever it is that you need in order to end your pain.

Thanks for the input.
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outofdarkness
Hi OOD

 

First of all I am feeling sorry for what you are going through.

 

I do agree with some of the posters - you need something for a change. But if hiring an PI isn't an option for you, as you have not decided yet what you want to do with what you will be presented, then I suggest the first step is to go back and read what LJ used to post to you in another forum. This is the time for you to focus on yourself instead of your husband and his (possible) affairs. I would give you kudos on changing his routines - not for the sake of you successfully stopping him from contacting his OWs who you don't even know existed; but for the sake of you two enjoying a nice talk and a romantic dinner after a day of stress at work.

 

If we go back to the basic of dating - it's about the excitement, the butterflies in the stomach feelings, the mind-blowing sex; not the routines, the predictability, the responsibilities. Surprise him like the way any OW would have done! Hold his hands and kiss him in public; kiss him on his forehead when he feels vulnerable; reach out and touch his pot belly, telling him that you love his pot belly more than anything in the world; shower him with little gifts and write him cards (naughty ones - hide them somewhere in his suitcase so he will find them when he unpacks in the hotel) your advantage is that you do all this with his money and you will enjoy it. It sounds like puppy love but men are basically a kid in heart!

 

Then the next thing is to focus on your own business. Discuss with him about your business that he will invest heavily in. While your kids are going away for schools or for whatever reasons, you have something to be busy with, something that you both spend effort on, something that cost him money and he would be expecting returns after he got retired.... he wouldn't leave you for any OWs in the future because he has invested so much. Even if he would, you won't be afraid. You have something to hold on to. You can live without him.

Thanks for the tips..will try them out.

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outofdarkness
:confused: I read to about post # 27 and just stopped.

 

You have a serial cheater who ( may ) or may not be cheating.

 

I have a few questions :

 

Why would you stay with someone who could not keep his jeans zipped around other women ?

 

To stay shows you must not respect yourself that much. ( Sorry but if it were me no matter how much I thought I loved him ) I would have ended it along time ago.

 

A GPS system. This shows a serious lack of trust. You dont seem to have the components of a good relationship. There is no trust , there is no communication ie ; possible deceit. and no respect for your feelings if he is climbing into the bed of another women.

 

What do you really have here ? : A GPS tracking system. A husband that lied to you. A husband likely depositing his DNA inside other women.

 

You may also have a repentant husband who is doing nothing behind your back and from past cheating issues you no longer trust him.

 

This is a recipe for a doomed relationship.

possibly, but does it really matter right now, and how does this relate to the question I had originally about the cell phone?

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outofdarkness

Thank you all for your input..I have no other comments other then what I've already replied to..I really had hoped to keep it focused on the cell phone question and not an in depth analysis of my M....

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dropdeadlegs
Thank you all for your input..I have no other comments other then what I've already replied to..I really had hoped to keep it focused on the cell phone question and not an in depth analysis of my M....

I am sorry for not staying on topic. I admit that it is sometimes hard when a thread is long and has veered from the original course so many times.

 

You have every right to expect an answer to your original question and the community guidelines specifically ask posters to simply answer the post in question. Thank you for the reminder. I am not an OW so I cannot answer your post and should not have replied at all.

 

I do wish for your son a speedy recovery to health. Best wishes to you and your family.

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outofdarkness
I am sorry for not staying on topic. I admit that it is sometimes hard when a thread is long and has veered from the original course so many times.

 

You have every right to expect an answer to your original question and the community guidelines specifically ask posters to simply answer the post in question. Thank you for the reminder. I am not an OW so I cannot answer your post and should not have replied at all.

 

I do wish for your son a speedy recovery to health. Best wishes to you and your family.

Thanks, I really appreciate it..

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Like I said : You don't trust him. You never will.

 

This is not about a cell phone.

 

This is about a cheater. And you own one. And are apparently trying to find fixes and devices when you will still come out ( no matter how you look at it ) with a cheater.

 

I find his actions disgusting. I don't find your acceptance to deal and stay with him very attractive either.

 

We all have choices. He chooses to cheat . You choose to stay with him.

 

Ask me about a cell phone and I will tell you what I know. Tell me you are using it to track a cheating husband and I will tell you what I know.

 

I know you didn't want hear it. Something tells me you are familiar in some way with men cheating on you in your past ?

 

Can't help you there because I don't pick cheaters.

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IfWishesWereHorses

The question was absolutely about a cell phone. Her thread, her question. Alot of us got way sidetraced discussing the things which we come here to discuss. Many people here care about OOD and have followed her story, so yes, they have added comments about her situation which is a much more common one that people realize.

 

You Mary3, could be of great help here on the infidelity board, possibly erradicate its need to even exist. Let us know, please, exactly how you KNOW who a cheater is. No one wants to marry and start a life with a cheater, tell us all, oh wise one, exactly how not to pick a cheater????

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