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Peace. That is what you need. Such a simple thing, but so wonderful to find again.

 

Your husband screwed up terribly and for a long time. He needs to admit that to himself and to you and he needs to SINCERELY start working on trying to be decent person and a good husband. I think he owes it to you to be understanding about your need to check and he should facilitate it in order to try to earn your trust back. When he has put something back in the trust bank, he can make a little withdrawal.

 

I fear there is no peace for you until you know if he is or isn't faithful. If you were not torturing yourself while you are 'annoying' him, I would be wishing him a million annoyances He deserves that and more. You deserve peace.

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TYASAFAHICSI
Re: Hiring a PI...Yes, financially it is possible, but to be honest, I am afraid of what they might find and I don't know if physically and emotionally, I can handle another D day...Mabey I'm underestimating myself, but I am gun shy about it. Keep on encouraging me and mabey I'll take that leap of faith and just do it one of these days. It sure would give me peace of mind and help me to move on w/ my life in either direction.

 

Then hire one! What is better, sitting here trackig his every move? Fearing that he MAY be cheating again? Living life under a clous of suspicion? This is not healthy for you, your hubby, your kids, friends, neighbors, employers, no none!

 

If this has become such an obsession with you, I think you need to find out if evidence exists and then move on in whatever direction you decide.

 

Send the PI, if he finds he is on the up and up, are you gonna believe he PI and return to a more normal life? Or are you going to doubt those findings as well?

 

Seems to me that you have been hurt -- and it sucks I know-- but no matter what logic is telling you---you are not willing to believe it. He answers your calls, he allows himself to be GPS tracked--yet you still believe that he is cheating. You are suspicious when he goes to Starbucks, but are unwilling to go down and see if he is doing the barista on the counter or not (I think not).

 

It is not menatally healthy for you to be tearing yourself up like this. You are jusst spinning your wheels here you are not moving forward or reverse. You are living in a self created hell and you need to get out of it--one way or the other.

 

I do feel bad for you and am not sticking up for either of you, but I can see both sides. When someone makes a mistake--no matter how big-- and is essentially forgiven (by you not divorcing him back then you have essentiallly forgiven) one reasonably woudl expect to well be forgiven.

 

I think your guys is probably NOT cheating and is a pretty stand up guy for putting up with all this.

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I think your guys is probably NOT cheating and is a pretty stand up guy for putting up with all this.

 

He's cheated with several women over a LONG time. How come you think he's suddenly not cheating..? I thought 'once a cheater always a cheater'... or does that only apply when a man falls in love with his OW, divorces, and marries her..? So much twaddle spoken on this site.

 

It's up to OOD how she deals with this, and for WIW, if he's complaining about being tagged after cheating on her with several women for something like a decade (if I remember anything like correctly) then he's an ass.

 

At the same time, as I've said before, OOD... do you want to trust him, or live with whatever he's doing, or find out and do something about it or what? Only you can know that. But you can't be sure of anything. No one can! Not one of us knows what our other half does or thinks half the time... either you accept what he says, or don't accept it... either way consider what you're getting out of knowing him/her.

 

What else can we do..?

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TYASAFAHICSI

OK so people cannot change. I am glad you finally sent me that memo. Wonder why I never got it!

 

It is my understanding that she wanted the GPS and he agreed and is paying for it. Not only would he be an ass but a fool to cheat.

 

Come on--if you are of the cheating ilk, are you really going to accept and tolerate someone tracking your every move. This is like people on house arrest. And while on house arrest, they do not commit crimes--look at the statistics.

 

I am not condoning what he did in the past. But I am saying that if she is willing to have him back in her life--she has to let him back in her life.

 

Once a cheater always a cheater. Once a fat ass always a fat ass. Once a liar always a liar. When did all this come to be fact?

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outofdarkness

Hey all,

I'm ok..just really tired and taking it easy today. My H arrived home last night after being gone since Mond. morn. W/ a sick child whom I have to home school, w/ the help of a tutoring service, and a daughter who still isn't driving yet, I'm wiped out by the end of the week after one of his travel binges. This is his job and I know this, but this is also when most of the cheating took place...so I get paranoid and scared about the travel. I am thinking about the tools that I have received to try to cope w/ this, but am having a hard time staying away from the temptations that seem to take hold when I am having a hard time coping w/ the past...I realize that only I am responsible for my happiness, but my self worth is not good, and I get it "funks" sometimes. It's hard to be in the same house; it's a small house, with him and not think about everything that he did sometimes. Some days are good, some bad...

 

To the poster that I blocked. I am sure that you meant well in your own way and I appreciate you trying to understand, I just dont' agree w/ your approach sometimes. But then again, this is part of life. I don't have to like everyone's approach, just know how to deal w/ it in an appropriate and respectful way, and know when to back away when necessary...It's not always so cut and dried and men seem to have a hard time w/ realizing that things are not always black and white...

 

I want to believe that he is telling me the truth, and I did look at him in the face and made him do the same, and point blank asked him if he cheated/is cheating...He told me NO...At the same time, his eyes were shifty and his voice low...I have learned to read body language and tones, etc...and try to admit things to myself that before, I would have denied...Some progress. Now..the question is where do I go from here...

 

Thanks to all...:)

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I just wanted to share my perspective, and you can block me as well because I agree with Art Critic and the guy that is blocked.

 

When I first came on to this site, I remember first reading one of your threads and posts and feeling the heart-wrenching pain everytime. And I would think "Oh no, not again. Don't tell me her H is still at at." But I know that that is nothing compared to what you must have felt/feel. :(

 

It is once said that a man speaks/ does things for a purpose. This should apply to you OOD even if you are female- if you're going to ask your H he's cheated, then think he seems like he's lying, and then do nothing about it- what was the point in asking? If you're going to look for evidence but don't do anything with it, what was the point in looking? It just seems like much ado about nothing (well, not really). Why put yourself in pain of knowing the truth if you don't want the truth? Why get angry at someone's opinion if you asked for it?

 

But still, you confuse me so. You tell us you want to keep your head out of the sand but need encouragement to get the thing that will tell you your answers-a PI. You say you're scared and don't know if you can take another Dday, but then track and watch your H every move like you want to know. If you don't want to know yet, then why check at all? And if you do, why not get the sure-fire way of finding out for real?

 

Also, you say you have become stronger, and earlier I thought you had too, but now I'm not so sure. You seem indecisive and insecure and ill-logical. Before the A, you said you were self-assured. Look at what you have become-stressed and sneaky and not really knowing what you want. Yes, affairs can change people, but you should not be a victim of it. You shouldn't lose yourself in it. Those were some valid reasons in staying in your marriage, but are they enough?

 

Maybe this is just a hard point in your life and you're going through the flashbacks of postDday. 2 years since DDay you might not have gotten over it yet? But it seems to me like..I don't know. You once posted about how worried you were because your H wanted sex as insurance before going off on a business trip and now you're worried about him sitting in a coffee shop. He could be cheating OOD and he could not be, but just finding out isn't going to alleviate your fears. If he is cheating, and you find out, then he stops, then starts back after 2 years, then what? If he isn't cheating, and you drop the subject feeling guilty for looking but relieved, but then he starts really cheating again and uses the excuse that maybe your not trusting in him hurt his relationship w/ you... It can go on and on.

 

You are actually one of the nicer of the BS, and I am inspired by your forgiveness and sincerity in dealing with your H. And you're right, sometimes you have to make a choice, and suffer the consequences of it. So here's my encouragement- choose the PI route and find out and until then give him the benefit of the doubt and work on your ill son/daugther.

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outofdarkness
I just wanted to share my perspective, and you can block me as well because I agree with Art Critic and the guy that is blocked.

 

When I first came on to this site, I remember first reading one of your threads and posts and feeling the heart-wrenching pain everytime. And I would think "Oh no, not again. Don't tell me her H is still at at." But I know that that is nothing compared to what you must have felt/feel. :(

 

It is once said that a man speaks/ does things for a purpose. This should apply to you OOD even if you are female- if you're going to ask your H he's cheated, then think he seems like he's lying, and then do nothing about it- what was the point in asking? If you're going to look for evidence but don't do anything with it, what was the point in looking? It just seems like much ado about nothing (well, not really). Why put yourself in pain of knowing the truth if you don't want the truth? Why get angry at someone's opinion if you asked for it?

 

But still, you confuse me so. You tell us you want to keep your head out of the sand but need encouragement to get the thing that will tell you your answers-a PI. You say you're scared and don't know if you can take another Dday, but then track and watch your H every move like you want to know. If you don't want to know yet, then why check at all? And if you do, why not get the sure-fire way of finding out for real?

 

Also, you say you have become stronger, and earlier I thought you had too, but now I'm not so sure. You seem indecisive and insecure and ill-logical. Before the A, you said you were self-assured. Look at what you have become-stressed and sneaky and not really knowing what you want. Yes, affairs can change people, but you should not be a victim of it. You shouldn't lose yourself in it. Those were some valid reasons in staying in your marriage, but are they enough?

 

Maybe this is just a hard point in your life and you're going through the flashbacks of postDday. 2 years since DDay you might not have gotten over it yet? But it seems to me like..I don't know. You once posted about how worried you were because your H wanted sex as insurance before going off on a business trip and now you're worried about him sitting in a coffee shop. He could be cheating OOD and he could not be, but just finding out isn't going to alleviate your fears. If he is cheating, and you find out, then he stops, then starts back after 2 years, then what? If he isn't cheating, and you drop the subject feeling guilty for looking but relieved, but then he starts really cheating again and uses the excuse that maybe your not trusting in him hurt his relationship w/ you... It can go on and on.

 

You are actually one of the nicer of the BS, and I am inspired by your forgiveness and sincerity in dealing with your H. And you're right, sometimes you have to make a choice, and suffer the consequences of it. So here's my encouragement- choose the PI route and find out and until then give him the benefit of the doubt and work on your ill son/daugther.

Thank you so much for your honest and frank post. I appreciate you pointing out some things that I just don't realize until I see them in writing and go back and look at my own posts. I know now that I sound like I have really contradicted myself. Yes, I am going through a rough patch...Yes, it's been over two years, but that is not an excuse for whining and becoming the victim again. Nobody likes a victim, and I had forgotten that until I re read some of my posts and your's as well...AND some P M's that I got that really got me thinking again..In the right direction this time.

 

I realize that it seems to everyone that I like to be the victim, the games, etc...I don't think this is the case, but rather that I have alot of fear of what I will find out and what I will do should I find out. I am scared of myself and how I might react. These are not fair excuses either. The old saying either s--- or get off the pot, it would seem, really apply to me. I know from being in therapy so much that it is counterproductive to talk, talk talk and do nothing to better your situation..Yet, I STILL go through times when I do just that.

 

The travel that my H does really gets under my skin b/c this is when much of the cheating took place, but I DID decide to stay of my own accord, so complaining about it is just not going to solve anything and you're right it only harms ME...he couldn't give a rats a-- about it..Today, I have tried to concentrate on contacting some friends who supported me during and after D day and come up with some strategies that will help me through this rough time and in the future when my H travels or goes to the coffee shop. I cannot patrol his every move, nor do I want to and I am well aware that this fosters mistrust and quite frankly, is very irritating to all involved. It really makes me feel like a nag...Believe it or not, you all, I really did have a life pre D day...I want it back and am willing to go to any lenghths to get it. At least I recognize the problem and am willing to try.

 

The poster that I blocked: You are correct..He brought up some valid points..I just did not like the way he worded it. I think that some of his posts have been crass and inappropriate...BUT he did make me think...That's what counts.

 

Thanks again for your honest post...That's why I come here...Blessings for a happy and safe holiday weekend!

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Freedom Now

OOD,

 

My wish for you is that you will do the healthiest thing for you and for your child.

 

This situation may have beat you down, but it has not vanquished you. You have far more strength than you realize.

 

Empower yourself. Go forward, get out of this limbo once and for all...and don't look back.

 

Whatever your decisions are (and only YOU will know what they may be): live authentically for you and for your child. Be true to yourself first and foremost and the rest will fall into place.

 

Be strong.

 

God's peace to you. :)

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outofdarkness
OOD,

 

My wish for you is that you will do the healthiest thing for you and for your child.

 

This situation may have beat you down, but it has not vanquished you. You have far more strength than you realize.

 

Empower yourself. Go forward, get out of this limbo once and for all...and don't look back.

 

Whatever your decisions are (and only YOU will know what they may be): live authentically for you and for your child. Be true to yourself first and foremost and the rest will fall into place.

 

Be strong.

 

God's peace to you. :)

Thanks....I cry now when I read you all's posts to me b/c it really is so touching to have people that you've never even met...care so much...

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Freedom Now

Many, many of us have been in places where we just don't know what direction we should take. I know I have been there. And, I am sure, many, many others understand those times when you are frozen in fear, not knowing which way to turn.

 

You are at a crossroad in your life. And I would like to share this quote with you...written by a woman in a similiar situation as yours....

 

"I finally admitted to myself that I have been treading water for such a long time in my life. I've been treading not knowing quite where to swim to, where the shore is for me. I'm afraid that if I just choose a direction and begin swimming, I may never find shore at all. Perhaps I'm waiting for a rescue boat to come out and save me.

 

What I have to face is that all this treading has caused me to become achingly tired. I feel the burn in my muscles. I am exhausted from trying to keep myself afloat. I know I'm not going anywhere like this, and I am faced with two options. One: I SWIM - swim, swim, and swim and find shore. Maybe I'm not THAT far away.

 

Or Two: I drown."

 

Swim, OOD, swim.

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outofdarkness
fn, that was a very touching post.

yes, it was and once again..made me cry...I am going to go swimming now!!!

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outofdarkness
good for you OOD, i bet you are a very good swimmer ;)

when I am stressed or sad or upset...yes, I am really a great swimmer...it helps me to work through things...seriously...I swam in high school and college!!! My daughter does too..

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TYASAFAHICSI
The poster that I blocked: You are correct..He brought up some valid points..I just did not like the way he worded it. I think that some of his posts have been crass and inappropriate...BUT he did make me think...That's what counts.

 

Awww, she is talking about me I think! Believe it or not, I did not mean to incite. Contrary to the moderators opinion that flagged me and gave me a warning. But hopefully my frank words would make you think.

 

You don't need to take my word as gospel, but it is always best to look at different angles. I always say there are three sides to a story---his, hers, and the truth!

 

Maybe if the moderator reads this, there might be a reversal of my flag?

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pureinheart
Then hire one! What is better, sitting here trackig his every move? Fearing that he MAY be cheating again? Living life under a clous of suspicion? This is not healthy for you, your hubby, your kids, friends, neighbors, employers, no none!

 

If this has become such an obsession with you, I think you need to find out if evidence exists and then move on in whatever direction you decide.

 

Send the PI, if he finds he is on the up and up, are you gonna believe he PI and return to a more normal life? Or are you going to doubt those findings as well?

 

Seems to me that you have been hurt -- and it sucks I know-- but no matter what logic is telling you---you are not willing to believe it. He answers your calls, he allows himself to be GPS tracked--yet you still believe that he is cheating. You are suspicious when he goes to Starbucks, but are unwilling to go down and see if he is doing the barista on the counter or not (I think not).

 

It is not menatally healthy for you to be tearing yourself up like this. You are jusst spinning your wheels here you are not moving forward or reverse. You are living in a self created hell and you need to get out of it--one way or the other.

 

I do feel bad for you and am not sticking up for either of you, but I can see both sides. When someone makes a mistake--no matter how big-- and is essentially forgiven (by you not divorcing him back then you have essentiallly forgiven) one reasonably woudl expect to well be forgiven.

 

I think your guys is probably NOT cheating and is a pretty stand up guy for putting up with all this.

 

So totally correct, the self torture is incredible in these situations leads to a type of insanity that is difficult to break. Letting go is hard in leaving or staying.

 

Many times this can become a game of sorts....the H cheats, gets caught, they fight, then the honeymoon stage, then suspicion and on the cycle goes.

 

I have put myself through many insane situations, and where did it get me? Very sick physically, all my life until it got to the point of life-threatening. Did it wake me up? YES. Am I done with insanity? YOU BET.

 

If I have to be single for the rest of my life, then so be it. If I have to move every insane person from my midst, then no problem. Life is WAY too short....I choose to be happy.

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outofdarkness
Awww, she is talking about me I think! Believe it or not, I did not mean to incite. Contrary to the moderators opinion that flagged me and gave me a warning. But hopefully my frank words would make you think.

 

You don't need to take my word as gospel, but it is always best to look at different angles. I always say there are three sides to a story---his, hers, and the truth!

 

Maybe if the moderator reads this, there might be a reversal of my flag?

Why do you have to be so condescending??? I got your point and everyone else's too!!! You all were right!!!!!!!!I am having a rough time for a few days...I'll try to remember not to post when I am...As far as blocking you and the moderator flagging you..Well..I still do not agree w/ your presentation/wording but I don't HAVE.. to...It's not my job...You could have gotten your point across another

way...Yes, I do agree w/ your three sides theory...and I certainly

DON'T take your word as the gospel..That's sort of insulting...

 

I know you didn't mean to incite...but I do think it needed to be pointed out...I did listen to you all and think that I 've gotten some great advice and frank constructive criticism...I am NOT a baby and do NOT need for someone that I don't even know to scold me and tell me that they might have made me "think"...I did nothing wrong...I did NOT make my H cheat for 10 years. Yes, if you go back and read some of my posts, they DO sound contradictory and illogical, etc..but at times, I AM!!! I think it's probably perfectly normal to have ups and downs after going through something like this...Thank you very much...I can't win for losing on here. I have a pity party, then apologize and ADMIT that I had sort of "fallen" off of my wagon, and I'm STILL criticized??? OK..It means soo much to you...I'm going to unblock you...Mabey you'll feel like having someone l--- your a--!!! How vulgar, even if it is on the forum that it's on!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad:

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outofdarkness
So totally correct, the self torture is incredible in these situations leads to a type of insanity that is difficult to break. Letting go is hard in leaving or staying.

 

Many times this can become a game of sorts....the H cheats, gets caught, they fight, then the honeymoon stage, then suspicion and on the cycle goes.

 

I have put myself through many insane situations, and where did it get me? Very sick physically, all my life until it got to the point of life-threatening. Did it wake me up? YES. Am I done with insanity? YOU BET.

 

If I have to be single for the rest of my life, then so be it. If I have to move every insane person from my midst, then no problem. Life is WAY too short....I choose to be happy.

see the post to the blocked, now unblocked one..

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TYASAFAHICSI

OK, well I think I am gonna get off this ride now. It is beginning to make me sick. Best of luck to you both. Hope it all works out for the best--whatever that may be!

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outofdarkness
see the post to the blocked, now unblocked one..

hope you feel better...bet you're just a bit queasy b/c some of what I said may be true???

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OOD - I think it is no surprise that you are confused and inconsistent and contradictory! You have a lot of competing issues and no clear choice. Once you have children you have a duty to them to try harder to resolve problems in your marriage and I don't think you can be faulted for your choice to try to get past your husband's affair.

 

I sense that you are at the end of your rope with this issue and it is no surprise to me, after all I spent a few years searching my then-husband's pockets and wallet EVERY SINGLE DAY. Being so anxious and suspicious is even more wearing than being the one suspected, I imagine.

 

I am still trying to puzzle out your situation along with you, OOD. I don't think you will be able to "talk yourself out of it", though creating some diversions for yourself might help reduce the amount of time you spend hand-wringing and imagining.

 

Tell me about these coffee shop forays, if you will. I apologize if you have already explained this, but does your husband sit in coffee shops while he is out of town on business or does he also do this while he is in town? If he does it while he is in town, I think it would be a gesture of his dedication to re-earning your trust if he were to STOP doing that and come home to drink coffee. He could work on his computer from home, surely.

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outofdarkness
OOD - I think it is no surprise that you are confused and inconsistent and contradictory! You have a lot of competing issues and no clear choice. Once you have children you have a duty to them to try harder to resolve problems in your marriage and I don't think you can be faulted for your choice to try to get past your husband's affair.

 

I sense that you are at the end of your rope with this issue and it is no surprise to me, after all I spent a few years searching my then-husband's pockets and wallet EVERY SINGLE DAY. Being so anxious and suspicious is even more wearing than being the one suspected, I imagine.

 

I am still trying to puzzle out your situation along with you, OOD. I don't think you will be able to "talk yourself out of it", though creating some diversions for yourself might help reduce the amount of time you spend hand-wringing and imagining.

 

Tell me about these coffee shop forays, if you will. I apologize if you have already explained this, but does your husband sit in coffee shops while he is out of town on business or does he also do this while he is in town? If he does it while he is in town, I think it would be a gesture of his dedication to re-earning your trust if he were to STOP doing that and come home to drink coffee. He could work on his computer from home, surely.

Hi...thanks for your post. RE: The coffee issue....Yes, he does sit in the coffee houses some while traveling, but mainly he goes to restaurants/bars alone...I guess? He can do this while he is traveling b/c I am a recovering alcoholic and he doesn't drink around me..I don't allow it in the house and we don't go out to bars anymore...It's just too big of a trigger for me. We do on occasion go out to eat, but no booze...As far as when he is IN town, he goes every day. Every morning before work, probably during lunch and almost every night. Sometimes, it's just for an hour or so, sometimes it's a few hours. Yes, I have brought up on occasion that it bothers me, and he stops for awhile, but it he inevitably starts back up, and I don't want to say anything to him b/c I can tell how irritated he gets about it. I have tried to explain to him that the reason it bothers me so much is because he admitted on D day that this is where he met and hung out so much w/ his OW's...It started in the late 90's, early 2000 when the coffee houses got so popular..Not just the big one, but the little mom and pop ones that were out of the way and had a really intimate cozy atmosphere. Not like the one on "friends" but much more cozy w/ love seats, out of the way places to sit and dark...I know b/c he took myself and the kids to a couple of these places years ago WAY before I knew about any cheating or OW's...He just would say; "Hey, I found this great place that has good bagels, coffee, etc, and the kids would love it b/c it has couches, not crowed, etc. It was when they were really young. I was repulsed after D day when I realized that he had taken us to the very places where he met up w/ his OW's and spent time w/ them. It was like some weird thrill to have his family in the same place where he had been w/ the OW's..I still don't know if any of them were actually there when we were b/c I don't know what any look like. Is this normal for a MM to take his family to places where he's frequented w/ his OW's..? I don't know. The same thing happened w/ some out of the way sort of obscure restaurants...It was just always presented in a light hearted way...Like he just wanted us to go to a cool new place he had found...Hope I gave you enough info...

 

Don't give a second thought to being puzzled about my story..It is a long, confusing and at times unbelievable one and hard for even me to fathom at times...Yes, diversions do help but it never goes away...

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Your husband likes to isolate himself, I gather.

 

I think he needs to stay home. As a show of faith. I don't understand why he feels so justified in taking more time away from his family and I have a lot of trouble with his need to go hide in a coffee shop with his computer. However, that is not the point so much as the fact he used those places for his rendezvous and to communicate with women by computer.

 

I am not saying it is easy to ask this. I know that my husband would be extremely irritated if I said he had to quit golfing, as he is VERY dedicated to golfing. However if he was meeting women on the golf course then he might need to make the sacrifice in order to save his marriage. Perhaps he would have to go golfing with me, and not otherwise, for as long as it took.

 

It is a huge sacrifice to give up a long-standing hobby, however HE is the one who used his hobby as a springboard for his affairs. If he were honest with himself, your husband would see why sitting in those coffee shops makes you so uncomfortable. If he regrets his behaviour, he may realize this loss is part of the price he must pay.

 

Of course, there is no point asking him to give up his coffee shop habit if this won't help you, OOD. If he were at home more, would you feel better?

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lovernotafighter

I say OOD if your going to stay with him you have to at least pretend like you trust him or your just gonna push him further away.

 

he did screw up...big time in fact but you also decided to stay in the relationship for what ever reason you did and that means you have forgiven him. in forgiveness you have to try to not let this eat you alive or else you really haven't forgiven him at all. right?

 

a relationship with out trust has nothing binding it together and sustain on it's own.

 

I read some where you were staying for your child, I think, if so then treat it as such. let it be about your child and let him do what ever till the time you can leave. however that can't be the case or this wouldn't be driving you as nuts as it is.

 

OOD get your power back, it's your life and there is no reason in this world you should have to continue to feel this way. you have only this life don't waste it on finding out what he's doing and start worrying about what your doing and what you will be doing with the time you have on this planet.

 

when you are finally free of this you will look back and ask your self why the hell you bothered...after all he is just a person when all is said and done and you deserve the kind of people you want not the ones you hope they will turn out like.

 

either way OOD your wasting your time..either quit worrying about him and give him his alone time with out incident so he can sense you are forgiving and learning to trust or just let him go completely if it just isn't possible for you to let this go. and if you cant do it psychically then do it mentally, spiritually. get your self out there and do things for you and find your self...it's the only way.

 

good luck OOD you'll be my heart.

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