new here-need input

[vanilla chai]

Let me get this straight he's been seeing you for only 7 months and all the sudden he wants out of his marriage? If he was so miserable why didn't he pack his sh*t and go before he started a affair with you?

[meinmke]

No, I never said he wanted out of his marriage because of me. He tells me he's been thinking about it before I came along. OW are catalyst. It might work out with us or it might not.

Also, if you are married or have been married you should know, its often not so easy for a someone to just pack their bags and leave-not only is it difficult to sort out your emotional factors other forces come to play especially when children and finances are tightly involved.

[crazy_grl]

I think MM did think everythign would work out smoothly. I think he's taking steps to leave his marriage but one of the things is that he wants W to agree that their marriage is over but he's seeing that it is not working out that way.

 

A way to speed up that process might be for him to just admit to the affair. But then it would be harder for him to keep stringing both of you along.

 

Have you asked him why he hasn't told her about it?

[crazy_grl]

BTW, your statement about OW being the catalyst for MM to leave is the exact opposite of what I've heard from OW in the past. I've heard that OW make it easier for MM to stay, because OW are meeting the needs they're not getting from their wife. They get to have a passionate sex life with someone who's crazy about them and yet they get to keep the same lifestyle (house, kids, etc). In their minds, keeping the OW as an OW is a win, win situation.

 

I don't know which is true, but to me, it makes more sense that OW make it easier on the MM to stay.

[meinmke]

crazy_grl,

On the part of telling her about the affair, it was a recommendation I made to him early in our relationship especially if he had plans to leave his marriage. I have seen many couples go through infidelity and not in every case, but in most-to admit to having an affair, espeically when the couple is already in the process of having a divorce, doesn't do any good. What does it prove? Only makes the other person feel worse- The problem in the marriages where the MM or MW chooses to leave has nothing to do with the OW or OM, there already is a problem in the marriage before MM or MW seeks something else. So in our case, I don't think it would do any good to tell her. MM makes the untimate decision on this because it wasn't me that make a commitment to her. Now, if MM wants to stay in the marriage, then I believe a good marriage is built on trust and perhaps he should admit to things to begin a healing process. Again in my case telling W about the A will not speed up the process-there is still a house/kids involved.

I call ow a catalyst because its just provokes an action, MM may leave-which is a significant change or continue relationship with OW and stay with W, whcih is also a change because MM is having to maintain two R.

As to making it easy for MM to stay in M, yes that is true, but the OW can drive her own happiness and doesn't have to take just crumbs. I thought about what is important to me in my life-my child and work. Knowing that the same must be true of MM, I told him those were my two priorities and those should be his first two-I'll be 3rd priority. Although he claims that work comes after me...

Anyway, the point being is that so far I have never not be able to reach him when I needed him. I see him when I need to see him-to me its just like having a normal boyfriend. Maybe I'm lucky...

[whichwayisup]

He told me that the environment at his house is exactly as he has been telling me for the past few weeks. We are sticking to the plans-he's moving out and we are looking for a place big enough for all of us-nothing has changed between us and he can't loose me-that its all going to be great, better for everyone-me and my son, him and his kids-even w.

He had brought up having a divorce, several times, split placement and custody of the kids, that he wasn't going to counseling-what does she want to do with the house, that she can afford to get an apartment after they sell the house.

 

DO NOT make ANY plans for your future with him. There isn't a chance in heck right now of this actually happening and you, your son move in with him and his kids, and his wife goes on happily alone, letting you have her husband. She doesn't know about you, and when she does, you're gonna have a HUGE fight on your hands. Don't think she's going to just hand him over to you - Especially since you've talked to her and she's clueless about your affair with him. She's going to be pissed off, hurt and felt like she's been made a fool of, by both of you.

 

Just go read 3 OM's threads recently, MW leaves husbands, and the OM are still waiting...Sorry, let me rephrase that, they've LEFT their husbands, but the OM are still waiting.....MW's need to be alone, deal with the fallout of the marriage ending, so IF your MM leaves his wife, expect your plans NOT to go smoothly, let alone the relationship (no longer affair) to just pick up where you two left off. Things will change and maybe not for the better when it comes to you.

 

I know you love him, just don't make ANY plans for the future, he really shouldn't be promising you anything, it's unfair.

[Guest]

I don't understand why the BS is always seen as the innocent victim and the OW/OM is seen as the evil villian. I was shocked when I read the initial post because the wife definitely dug her own hole.

 

There would be no way in the world I would find some strange woman's number in my husband's phone and attempt to "befriend" her for any purpose.

If she is attempting to collect information, it's stupid. If she genuinely seeks friendship, its stupid.

 

People only do what you allow them to and quite frankly, doormats don't get respect from anyone. We simply use them to wipe the dirt from our soles and keep on moving.

 

I don't think we could totally see many of the "players" in these situations as victims and villians. We're all just a bunch of everyday people, with experiences, fears, emotions, and personalities that create difficult situations.

[vanilla chai]

I know you love him, just don't make ANY plans for the future, he really shouldn't be promising you anything, it's unfair.

 

I certainly don't think the bw is gonna let her hubby take the children and move on in with his ow and live happily ever after.

 

If my husband tried to pull that crap on me he would have hell to pay. I wouldn't care what he did with his life, but screw with the babies and I get ugly.

[whichwayisup]

Well, the way this guy, her MM is making it sound, and she's thinking it could happen that way - IS crap. It's all fantasy and 'what if's...' There's NO way his wife will let him take the kids and move in with his OW after he divorces her. No way.... ANd you';re right, hell to pay is the understatement here, she'll

[meinmke]

He's not talking about taking full custody, our state prefers joint custody and placement for the kids-So 50/50 placement with the kids and me being involve won't hurt anything bc I'm not a threat to the children-he's already talk to a relative who is a judge in the family courts. Vanilla-you must think what is best for the children-if you were in this situation and if you were bitter about the divorce-using the children for vengence only hurts the children the most.

Anyway, I'm keeping my apartment at least until the end of the summer-we are looking for an apartment together with the intention that I'll move in later. Anyway, the two of them only knew each other for 6 weeks before they got married so why should she be surprised if we say we started our relationship next month and I end up moving in with him a few months after that. And as MM mentioned to me, whether she knows or suspects we had a affair - that is something she needs to deal with.

So Vanilla Chai, what is your story and why are you so bitter?

[whichwayisup]

Anyway, the two of them only knew each other for 6 weeks before they got married so why should she be surprised if we say we started our relationship next month and I end up moving in with him a few months after that. And as MM mentioned to me, whether she knows or suspects we had a affair - that is something she needs to deal with.

 

Because they got married and have children together!!! He can't just end his marriage and POOF move in with you - Turn his children's lives upside down and expect EVERYBODY to just go on with life, happy go lucky!! Come on, you're a smart woman...He will need time to adjust, and most of all, so will his children. You don't just shove kids in the mix of it, like here's your new step mommy - Our new house, your new step brother/sister...Slow down.........

 

They have a house together, they have family! His family, his inlaws, neighbours, friends...Let alone finances that need to be looked after. You are only seeing a TINY side of it, there's so much more. Not just a divorce and he's YOURS.

 

Sorry, don't mean to sound harsh, but you need to take a step back and think ahead. See the full picture here and take the blinders off.

[meinmke]

LOL, exactly what I am thinking whichway...

Nothing is a for sure thing, which is why I am keeping my apartment at least until the end of the summer. Also the fact that they have a house together, children involved, mixed finances etc. That's why he can't just pack his bags up and leave his marriage. His friends all know about our relationship and our plans (and I've become friends with some of his friends too) None of them like her very much because she won't let them into the house and have said nasty angry things to them when they do try to come over.

They don't have any mutual friends and she even told me her only friends lives in another town 2 hours away.

MM told me his mother in law left a message on their phone earlier today telling their daughter its her fault about the divorce and not to expect sympathy and she shouldn't have spread all the rumors she has been trying to spread about him.

Well, I don't know her but from what I hear is that no one likes her or supports her. And yes, I do slightly feel sorry for her-that it seems like she won't have any support when she goes through what she will be going through.

But the funny thing is I told MM that I posted my dilema on this board and I've been reading him some of your responses. He's the mushy, romantic type and keeps saying that "they don't know, it's true love" I on the otherhand am not so romantic and say to him "I really need to leave your ass"

[whichwayisup]

"they don't know, it's true love"

 

If it truely was, he'd move heaven and earth to be with you now. The divorce would be happening NOW and he'd be making sure his kids are OK, his wife is taken care of, and making the transition as easy as possible...

 

Ofcourse none of us know you, him or the situation first hand, we just know what we read, and most also know how MOST of this situations turn out. Many who think "MY situation is different, or special" realizes at some point, it isn't. Different people, slightly different situations, but the outcomes are usually similar. Alot pain, confusion and hurt feelings ALL around.

 

I'm sure he does love you, but he needs to sheeyt or get off the pot and not string along TWO women.

 

I feel sad for his wife because she doesn't know what's about to hit her. And please, tell him this, when and IF the time comes he tells her, make sure SHE gets support, whether it be from friends, her family or a therapist. She will need it badly.

[meinmke]

Thanks whichway

and I actually don't mind if people are harsh because it's giving me a chance to check my emotions and thought process.

I think he is trying to "move heavean and earth" at least as much as he can. No the divorce papers aren't signed, but I know he's been preparing finances, plans for joint child placement.

And I don't know what he tells her or what really goes on in their household, but told that they are sleeping in different rooms, neither are wearing wedding bands (wife also admitted those in a phone conversation)

My son and me meeting his kids are casual, to them I'm just a friend of their dads-meet at public places. They are young-the oldest one is 5, but old enough to have horrid memories if we don't plan a smooth transition.

 

Yes, absolutely, W must feel she has a network. MM and I have talked about this...she is the mother of his children and needs to come out of this better than ok and I know they will alway have a connection with each other because of the children.

[crazy_grl]

crazy_grl,

On the part of telling her about the affair, it was a recommendation I made to him early in our relationship especially if he had plans to leave his marriage. I have seen many couples go through infidelity and not in every case, but in most-to admit to having an affair, espeically when the couple is already in the process of having a divorce, doesn't do any good. What does it prove? Only makes the other person feel worse- The problem in the marriages where the MM or MW chooses to leave has nothing to do with the OW or OM, there already is a problem in the marriage before MM or MW seeks something else. So in our case, I don't think it would do any good to tell her. MM makes the untimate decision on this because it wasn't me that make a commitment to her. Now, if MM wants to stay in the marriage, then I believe a good marriage is built on trust and perhaps he should admit to things to begin a healing process. Again in my case telling W about the A will not speed up the process-there is still a house/kids involved.

 

My point was that if he's waiting for her to agree, then if he told her it might speed up the process. I were married to a guy who was cheating and especially watching me make a fool of myself by letting me talk to his OW (which he's convinced me isn't his OW and probably told me I'm just "paranoid" about them), I'd boot him out the door in a second.

 

But then again, if she doesn't boot him, it could have the opposite affect and he might decide to stay and work on his marriage. Wouldn't be the first guy who was dead set on being with the OW then after d-day switched immediately to wanting to work it out with his W.

 

Anyway, my main point wasn't that he should tell but that I think he's making excuses by saying he wants her to agree the marriage is over. I'm not convinced at this point that he's even told his wife that he wants one. So far, everything just seems like the same old tricks every other MM uses. Unless he shows you the divorce papers ready to be filed, I don't think you should believe him.

 

And don't fool yourself into thinking that his W is going to believe that you just suddenly started dating after the divorce. Unless she's an idiot, she'll know, even if she can't prove it. Once she finds out you're together, she is NOT going to be happy and chances are good that it'll get ugly.

[Guest]

While I may not be welcome here as a BS, I can tell you that lying to the W as you did when asked directly was cruel. Her instincts about you and her H are spot on, but now you have confused her and led her to wonder if she is paranoid? This happened to me and boy was I angry when I had definite proof - they had both told me they were just friends when they had a chance to tell me the truth, but they opted to continue to lie and disorientate me for their own very selfish reasons.

 

And to say you will consider being a friend? Why would you do this, unless you want to get some perverse satisfaction out of it? How could you sit with her and lie and pretend to be a friend to her when you actually want her H to leave her to be with you???

 

Hey, affairs happen, marriages fail, but to behave like that when the W suspects is just adding insult to injury. Have some dignity and withdraw from the situation until he decides who he wants to be with, or at least stop having contact with the W.

[vanilla chai]

He's not talking about taking full custody, our state prefers joint custody and placement for the kids-So 50/50 placement with the kids and me being involve won't hurt anything bc I'm not a threat to the children-he's already talk to a relative who is a judge in the family courts. Vanilla-you must think what is best for the children-if you were in this situation and if you were bitter about the divorce-using the children for vengence only hurts the children the most.

 

I guess your mm wasn't thinking what was best for his children while sleeping around on their mother.

 

You have 7 months out the gate and already you are moving him in. Does that seem realistic to you? don't you think he ought to get his own place?

 

So Vanilla Chai, what is your story and why are you so bitter?

 

My story? there is no story. Im married and no my husband didn't betray me. Im hardly bitter.Not everyone who comes to this board is a betrayed spouse.

[Virgo1982]

DO NOT make ANY plans for your future with him. There isn't a chance in heck right now of this actually happening and you, your son move in with him and his kids, and his wife goes on happily alone, letting you have her husband. She doesn't know about you, and when she does, you're gonna have a HUGE fight on your hands. Don't think she's going to just hand him over to you - Especially since you've talked to her and she's clueless about your affair with him. She's going to be pissed off, hurt and felt like she's been made a fool of, by both of you.

 

Just go read 3 OM's threads recently, MW leaves husbands, and the OM are still waiting...Sorry, let me rephrase that, they've LEFT their husbands, but the OM are still waiting.....MW's need to be alone, deal with the fallout of the marriage ending, so IF your MM leaves his wife, expect your plans NOT to go smoothly, let alone the relationship (no longer affair) to just pick up where you two left off. Things will change and maybe not for the better when it comes to you.

 

I know you love him, just don't make ANY plans for the future, he really shouldn't be promising you anything, it's unfair.

 

 

Is it me or does the wife sound like she's not too bright? Why meet with the OW? I would hire a private detective before I asked to meet the OW. And if her motivation was to guilt the OW out of being with her husband, she really is dumb.

[crazy_grl]

she really is dumb.

 

Love will sometimes do that to you.

[meinmke]

This past week has been packed with so many events.

 

It started on Monday-we decided to meet for happy hour. As we were getting out of the car, I told him, "I think I am going to dump your ass." We talked about things over drinks and he kept saying he can't lose me-so many times I kept on telling myself that I can be strong enough to just walk away-but I didn't.

Usually, he just drops me off to my place after happy hour, but this time, he followed me inside...time went by-W kept calling him on his cell-he didn't pick up.

W finally called my cell and I wasn't sure what to say-I finally decided to tell her he wasn't there. I told him he needed to do something and he couldn't just sit there, so he finally called her back-he stepped out of the room so I'm not really sure what was said. I asked what was going on and he said, "I told her she can kiss my ass" More time went on she kept calling him, he kept saying he'll be right there, he's walking to the car, etc-told her he was over my place. But never budging...

After their last conversation they had that evening, he looks over and me to tell me I'm stuck with him-she was not letting him into the house. Around 2 am, she tries to call him again, he ignored it, then she calls my phone, I pick it up and we have a very unusual conversaiont-well not really a conversation-she was doing all the talking-pouring her heart our about their marriage-someone to talk to, trying to get me feel guilty, trying to make him sound like a horrible person-I wasn't sure what her intentions were. But I kept repeating to her that I couldn't really comment, that she needs to talk to him because there was definately a disconnection between what he is telling me and what she is saying.

Also, we talked about the friday night before, she told me they were splitting a bottle of wine and talking about their marriage and all of a sudden he gets up and announces that he's going over my place. I told her, One of the few things I commented to her was "That's interesting, Do you think he likes me."

I asked her what she wanted me to tell him about the morning, logisticwise-he'll need fresh clothes, etc. I also suggested that perhaps she shouldn't be there-they need space.

 

My baby needs my attention- More of the exciting Soap Opera to continue...

[movinon05]

Wow! Just Wow! I can't even go further!

[meinmke]

So Tues. morning, we get up. We start to plan our day. He tells me he needs to pick up clothes and other stuff at his house and ask if I could spend the day with him. We drop my son at day care. He calls W and asks where she is-she tells him she is at work. We head up to their house. As we get there there is an unrecognizable car parked in his driveway. He calls W and asks whose car it is. She says she doesn't know. He heads in, I stay in the car. I can see movement in the house through the window, but couldn't get a good look to see if they were male or female, just know that there are more people than MM in the house. I know W is there. LOL, I keep thinking the worse-what could I do if I hear gunshots-I left my cell phone at home-what would I do...

I see a male fumbling with the lock-dressed in a uniform-ah, she wants to change the locks in the house. I'm giggling a bit to myself-she can't lock him out of the house-there is no domenstic violence, he owns the house too and can't keep him out...etc.

The locksmith finally leaves, gets in his car and sits there for a while with a confused look on his face. I'm still in the car, been there for 30 minutes-decided debating if I should see what is going on, drive away or wait a bit longer...

MM comes out with W following him...he gets in the car, she is trying to hold the door open. "please, lets talk,"she begs.

"it's over" he says. I'm sitting in the passengers seat and I reach over to introduce myself telling her "sorry to meet in such unpleasant circumstances" She then looks at me and ask me to tell MM to talk to her. I put my hands up and say-"you know it's really between the two of you, I'm staying out of this but maybe the two of you need sometime to decompress"

We take off-he's- a bit of silence-he is deep in thought-He finally says"Everything will work out-it will be better for everyone, soon" he says. I ask him about the locksmith, he says he told the guy to get the "Fxck out of his house" and was kind of laughing at the fact that they always keep that door unlocked and he doesn't even have a key to it.

I don't know what to say to him-mostly I try to keep the conversation light...

There is a lot more, but everything is starting to get blurred, so I need to pause and think about what happened next.

More to come...

[crazy_grl]

One of you needs to develop a heart and be honest with the poor woman about the affair. You're both cruel.

[Seen_It_All]

I asked what was going on and he said, "I told her she can kiss my ass.."

 

Wow, that's quite the PRIZE you're going to get, you lucky, lucky girl.

[meinmke]

I try to remain focus on my own life-my child and other things I need to do.

He returns that evening-I was actually shock, preparing myself that he wouldn't show back up. He looked distraught-telling me that W was begging him to stay. About his 5 yr old-it was hard for her-he told me he almost brought her to my place with him but, he finally got her to sleep.

The next morning, she calls several time-but the last call from her to MM, is their 5 year old is screaming at the mirror-I want my daddy. I tell him he'd better go-he leaves but returns almost immediately. W called him while he was on his way and told him she was able to get her to calm down and take her to school.

Later-she called him-they decide to meet for lunch to talk about next steps for kids. I'm feeling uneasy, knowing it's too early-but need some time to just let everything sink in-at least on my end I could tell MM wasn't ready-so always a chance he might not come back.

He does come back. He tells me he is picking up daughter early from school so they can spend some quality time together-but we had a few hours together. He asks me what's wrong. I noticed he was wearing his wedding band. I can't even remember what we talked about-everything, our marriages, life, dreams, careers-He left telling me that was the best conversation he ever had. That I was the most amazing woman he ever met and he was going to fix everything- in the next few hours he was going to fix everything. Again, I tried to stay focus on things I needed to do in my own life. He'd call occationally to check up on me, He didn't return that night-never did what he said he was going to do to fix everything-He did call before he went to bed, he was kind of drunk but told me he loved me and just needed to go to sleep.

But that's not where it ends, still more....