God made us to be like HIM?

[Moai]

Supernatural, in the sense that the bishop uses the term, refers to God. If nature is the world around us as we know it, then God is the Supernatural because he is the nth degree of that. Or so I understand the definition ...

 

But there are more supernatural beliefs than just his, or yours. Again, why are theirs wrong and yours right?

 

And does that not suggest that god is outside of nature?

 

consumerism = atheism ... I didn't post all of the document, so the argument about atheism was left out, but his point is that when people get so caught up in possessions, it has the same outcome as atheism, where God is not welcomed.

 

Hence Buddhist monks shunning all possessions. Not a particularly new, or unique idea.

 

your thoughts about "hopes for a future life" being dangerous surprise me, because I think you understand that not everyone who has claimed religion is a kook who wants to kill for God/Allah/Yahweh.

 

Well, they are all kooks to a certain extent.

 

Those are extremists, who thank goodness are only a drop in the pot of soup called religious belief. A good number of people are steady Joes with a strong belief in a Supreme Being, who do their best to share the their faith by practicing love and kindness and generosity.

 

Maybe. I find it interesting that most of the morality I see around me has nothing to do with religion, and in fact goes against it in many instances.

 

lovely sarcastic comment, but you forget about the KKK, who feel they are doing right by Jesus when they perpetrate acts of hatred against those they identify as "different" ...

 

I haven't forgotten them, but they don't blow themselves up. And I would say that they are racists first, Christians second. Jesus is a large part of their dogma, though.

[quankanne]

I will say that I am much happier, that the world makes much more sense now, and I live without fear. I hope that all people can experience the world as I do, as I cannot describe the joy with which I meet each day, and the genuine affection I have for others, as opposed to before.

 

¡lo mismo! This is how I feel …*that my faith helps clarify those events and things that initially don't make sense because there is something greater at work that I can trust in. An assurance that all will be well, no matter what happens or how things play out. And that is priceless.

 

I think that sometimes we find it hard to understand how someone arrives at the same point without some kind of spiritual belief because it's so different from our own experience as believers ...

 

It is my hope that one day you will free yourself of the shackles of your superstition

 

we're shackled because we've got spiritual guidelines that help us to avoid occasions of sin? Not sure why people consider these parameters "bad," when they help us strive to be better people.

 

Even chimpanzees show altruism to other members in their immediate group, caring for the young of others and feeding and protecting members that are crippled or injured. According to the logic of believers then the motivation for this would have to be Jesus or some other mythical being.

 

are you likening yourself to a generous monkey because you choose to express goodness without what you consider a "safety net" of spirituality?

 

why is embracing a spiritual role model such a threatening thing if it helps us to be better people? Because you don't understand the need for such a thing means that others around you shouldn't need it.

[quankanne]

But there are more supernatural beliefs than just his, or yours. Again, why are theirs wrong and yours right?

 

And does that not suggest that god is outside of nature?

 

yes, there are more than just the one supernatural belief that I talk about, but mine is right for me. The most I can ever hope to do is be a positive model of the faith that I claim, someone who helps give people an opportunity to think outside the comfort of their own belief system. Much like this dialogue has done the past several days.

 

God outside nature – I suppose that can be one definition of "supernature," but that is not the context of my writings or viewpoint, which is God as nature magnified greatly because he is author of all things living ...

[Green]

while we are here talking about if god made us like him I just must say I find that avatar so disturbing

[Moai]

¡lo mismo! This is how I feel …*that my faith helps clarify those events and things that initially don't make sense because there is something greater at work that I can trust in. An assurance that all will be well, no matter what happens or how things play out. And that is priceless.

 

I think that sometimes we find it hard to understand how someone arrives at the same point without some kind of spiritual belief because it's so different from our own experience as believers ...

 

I don't know. It is self-evident that the Universe is bigger than I am. I wouldn't say I "trust" in anything, though.

 

we're shackled because we've got spiritual guidelines that help us to avoid occasions of sin? Not sure why people consider these parameters "bad," when they help us strive to be better people.

 

Well, the idea of sin itself is a superstition. And if religion is what keeps you from being a criminal or cruel, than by all means keep believing in it, but it doesn't keep most people from being better people. People seem to behave the same way regardless of which religion they are. Supposedly 4% of the US population have no belief in God, yet well over 4% of the population is in prison. I would argue that atheists are actually more moral, since they are certainly under-represented in the correctional system.

 

are you likening yourself to a generous monkey because you choose to express goodness without what you consider a "safety net" of spirituality?

 

why is embracing a spiritual role model such a threatening thing if it helps us to be better people? Because you don't understand the need for such a thing means that others around you shouldn't need it.

 

It isn't threatening, it is unnecessary, can cause and has caused, a great deal of suffering. There is noting inherently wrong with any belief system, it is the expression of that belief that causes problems.

[sb129]

Religions were invented so that the fat cats could control the masses.

[quankanne]

while we are here talking about if god made us like him I just must say I find that avatar so disturbing

 

which avatar are you talking about?

 

Well, the idea of sin itself is a superstition. And if religion is what keeps you from being a criminal or cruel, than by all means keep believing in it, but it doesn't keep most people from being better people. People seem to behave the same way regardless of which religion they are. Supposedly 4% of the US population have no belief in God, yet well over 4% of the population is in prison. I would argue that atheists are actually more moral, since they are certainly under-represented in the correctional system.

 

sin a superstition? Hmm, that's an interesting take on it – maybe that's what's landing so many people in prison, because they don't feel they must a sense of wrong and they get busted for perpetrating acts? Humor me, I'm just reaching here as I try it on for size. My thought is that yeah, sin can be considered superstition by someone who doesn't assign it the same value, much like I think the people who cross themselves or worry about mal ojo are superstitious – those things are very real to them, and therefore not truly superstition.

 

It isn't threatening, it is unnecessary, can cause and has caused, a great deal of suffering. There is nothing inherently wrong with any belief system, it is the expression of that belief that causes problems.

 

I dunno, Moai – I've run across some posters who feel threatened by those ideas and beliefs that don't jibe with theirs, and identify those opposing beliefs as threats ... even if the other person is willing to agree to disagree with respect.

[Moai]

sin a superstition? Hmm, that's an interesting take on it – maybe that's what's landing so many people in prison, because they don't feel they must a sense of wrong and they get busted for perpetrating acts? Humor me, I'm just reaching here as I try it on for size. My thought is that yeah, sin can be considered superstition by someone who doesn't assign it the same value, much like I think the people who cross themselves or worry about mal ojo are superstitious – those things are very real to them, and therefore not truly superstition.

 

While crimes are sins, not all sins are crimes. I can covet all I want, and nobody would know. I am not aware of anyone imprisoned for adultery over the last 100 years or so--maybe longer. While sodomy laws are still on the books in some states, when such a thing happens between consenting adults that law is unenforceable. I myself work on Sunday--and Saturday, if that happens to be your Sabbath. I imagine sex with just about every attractive girl I see.

 

Take that last one. It is necessary for the species to continue for me to covet women. Why would it be a sin to feel urges that are completely natural and enjoyable?

 

Superstitions are still superstitions, regardless of how ardently someone believes it. Crossing yourself, chicken feet, walking under ladders, broken mirrors--they are all equally superstitious. None of them actually do anything, or mean anything, but people fervently believe them.

 

I dunno, Moai – I've run across some posters who feel threatened by those ideas and beliefs that don't jibe with theirs, and identify those opposing beliefs as threats ... even if the other person is willing to agree to disagree with respect.

 

Sure, but there is no law that protects you from feeling threatened, nor should there be. Feeling threatened and being offended are part of living in a free society.

[quankanne]

okay, you've got me stumped: Chicken feet?

[Moai]

okay, you've got me stumped: Chicken feet?

 

Voodoo. Chicken feet carry various meanings in voodoo, and can curse and/or curse you.

[lonelybird]

If I believe in me is that the same a believing in satan????

NO.

I did believe in myself like you did. and laughed the Christian sisters, and reasoned with them, and happied after I beat them with my questions. I thought they are just simple minded, ya, I guess God want to show me how stubborn I was. I think God is quite humor:laugh: .

By the way, scientists really are doing excellent jobs, just remember the movie a beautiful mind , when you find true love you find God

[lonelybird]

Thank you, but I would hope that you take the time praying for me (prayer doesn't work anyway) and pick up a science book and read it. It is my hope that one day you will free yourself of the shackles of your superstition, and see the world for the wonderful place that it is.

Or, you are in the process to understand the world and yourself well. maybe you came out of the 'religion' you understood in the beginning, and now to a new step, but this is not the final step yet.

The world without spiritual sides is far from freedom, lots of bondage. if we look other discussion sections, it is easy to understand. e.g slaves of money, slaves of material, slave of other people's needs and opinion, slave of situation, slave of sexual desires...

what can make you satisfying? when you chieve a certain goal, what next

[lonelybird]

But there are more supernatural beliefs than just his, or yours. Again, why are theirs wrong and yours right?

you worry so much:p I trust God in this. Everyone eagerly seek God or love will find it.

[lovelorcet]

NO.

I did believe in myself like you did. and laughed the Christian sisters, and reasoned with them, and happied after I beat them with my questions. I thought they are just simple minded, ya, I guess God want to show me how stubborn I was. I think God is quite humor:laugh: .

By the way, scientists really are doing excellent jobs, just remember the movie a beautiful mind , when you find true love you find God

 

Well considering the fact that there is no such thing as "true love" or a soulmate, that one is going to take a while.

[lonelybird]

Well considering the fact that there is no such thing as "true love" or a soulmate, that one is going to take a while.

I have confidence in you. You will find your soulmate, well, beyond your biological explaination:p

[lovelorcet]

There is no such thing as a soulmate and thinking that there is is very unhealthy.

[lonelybird]

There is no such thing as a soulmate and thinking that there is is very unhealthy.

Did you ever watch movie The celestine prophecy? From the movie you can see what make a successful relationship. the philosophy behind the story is quite true.

Why 'soulmate' or true love isn't healthy?

[lovelorcet]

Did you ever watch movie The celestine prophecy? From the movie you can see what make a successful relationship. the philosophy behind the story is quite true.

Why 'soulmate' or true love isn't healthy?

 

The idea that there is just one person who is to be your partner in life is preposterous and it also leads to expectations which are unreal and just naive.

 

There are billions of women on this planet and I am sure that I could lead a happy and successful relationship with thousands of different women. But of course I will never even meet most of them.

 

At some point in life we may make a choice as to which partner we would like to spend the rest of our lives with. That was our choice and I believe we have a responsibility to stick to it. There will always be someone else who can come along and we will find them attractive and it is very possible that we could also lead a healthy relationship with that person. But that is no reason to walk away from the responsibility which we already have.

 

If you read here enough you will see that many people use the "soulmate" excuse to cheat or they just generally have their head stuck in their butts.

 

The other problem with the idea of soul-mate is that there is an inherent part of that which makes many think that a partner search is controlled by destiny. Finding and maintaining a healthy relationship is HARD WORK and there is no "destiny" to it.

[lonelybird]

The idea that there is just one person who is to be your partner in life is preposterous and it also leads to expectations which are unreal and just naive.

 

There are billions of women on this planet and I am sure that I could lead a happy and successful relationship with thousands of different women. But of course I will never even meet most of them.

 

At some point in life we may make a choice as to which partner we would like to spend the rest of our lives with. That was our choice and I believe we have a responsibility to stick to it. There will always be someone else who can come along and we will find them attractive and it is very possible that we could also lead a healthy relationship with that person. But that is no reason to walk away from the responsibility which we already have.

 

If you read here enough you will see that many people use the "soulmate" excuse to cheat or they just generally have their head stuck in their butts.

 

The other problem with the idea of soul-mate is that there is an inherent part of that which makes many think that a partner search is controlled by destiny. Finding and maintaining a healthy relationship is HARD WORK and there is no "destiny" to it.

um, good points, but I still believe one made just for another. and I agree with you, if you vow, and then stick with that vow. couple enbrace full 4 types love, then their love will increase not decrease.

 

But what's wrong with partner search is controlled by destiny? if believe destiny, and when meet one, fine, happy; if not meet yet, fine, not right time right place yet, content:) . as for in the marriage, oh God will help me:rolleyes:

[lovelorcet]

A real man makes his own destiny.

[lovelorcet]

as for in the marriage, oh God will help me:rolleyes:

 

No he will not... You have to do the work yourself.

[Love Hurts]

In as much as its a joy shedding the light of the Lord;

that others may see.

 

There too must come a time to realize Matthew 7:6 ;

 

Give not that which is holy unto the dogs,

neither cast ye your pearls before swine,

lest they trample them under their feet,

and turn again and rend you.

 

As for myself …Im finished with this thread...

Somewhere someone is sincere and seeks to gain a

better understaning.

 

Lonelybird it was a good thread…

It looks as though it has run its course.

LB and Quankanne any the rest of you in the Lord… Great Job!

 

God Bless*

________________________________

 

As always...even still if you feel;

one is sincerely hungering for the word of God

and does seek Him... Hang in there.

[quankanne]

There is no such thing as a soulmate and thinking that there is is very unhealthy.

 

you really feel that way? I too scoff at the idea of having a romantic soulmate, but I believe there are people who come into your life who fully complement the person you are because there is some sort of metaphysical connection between you and that person. Gender is not of importance, because that link transcends the romantic aspect of a relationship between soulmates of the opposite sex. The best thing I can come up with the effect of pheromones attracting mates of the opposite sex ...

 

The idea that there is just one person who is to be your partner in life is preposterous and it also leads to expectations which are unreal and just naive.

 

biologically speaking, no, it doesn't make sense to limit oneself to one partner if the ultimate goal is to procreate with the intention of producing the best quality specimen of the F1 generation. However, social conditioning and (dare I say it) emotions lead us to winnow down the search to one mate for what you hope will be a lifetime pairing. On the outset, yeah, that's an unreal expectation, but only if you factor in the biological aspect. Humans are much more than their biological parts – emotions and thoughts ... and spirituality ... come into play, and help induce conditions to support that goal of a lifetime monogamous relationship. Or to put it another way, we're a hopeful and optimistic people when pursuing what we desire. Otherwise why would so many people attempt marriage again after failing the first, second or subsequent times? Something in them has identified the need for a partner, even when they know there's a 50-50 shot of getting it right!

[quankanne]

There too must come a time to realize Matthew 7:6 ;

 

Give not that which is holy unto the dogs,

neither cast ye your pearls before swine,

lest they trample them under their feet,

and turn again and rend you.

 

true. But as posted above, we continue to be a hopeful and optimistic people. Remember the saying, "dance as if no one is watching"? I think believers must follow that advice, and love Him as though no one cares.

 

at some point, someone is going to notice and want to know why you're dancing so joyously!

[TheDC]

at some point, someone is going to notice and want to know why you're dancing so joyously!

 

Yes and hopefully they'll do the rational thing and lock you up and have you treated for lunacy.