Is he breaking up with me?

[Amneris]

Sunday morning and I woke up early because I can't sleep...

 

Motti and I have known each other for about a year and a half and have carried on a semi-long distance relationship for that amount of time. He is twice my age, a retired educator and psychologist- he has some clients that come to him, actually at the moment only one male.

 

At first he wasn't sure if my love for him was true because he thought I might just be playing with him (experimenting) because he was so much older than me, and he was afraid of making any definite decision as to our status, but then as time went on he saw and understood that I reallly loved him.

 

We had our ups and downs like everybody. For example when I visited him last year during the X-mas holidays, he had a special "method" of how to wash dishes as he is a bit paranoid of getting germs or catching a disease thru food. I found this a bit silly, and we argued about it, but I eventually "adapted" to his method.

He has been living alone for a long time (divorced 20 odd years ago) and like any person who lives alone for such a long time he developed particular habits of doing things only one way.

 

He always told me he didn't like arguing and wanted "peace and quiet" in his life because arguing gives him tension which is not good for his health. But many of the arguements were brought on by him in a way. For example, once we were at a buffet restaurant and he reminded me not to take too many servings of carbohydrates, and I told him to "leave me alone". An unpleasant arguement developed as a result to which he told me he was only trying to help me since I myself had said I wanted to loose weight (I'm was never fat).

 

Sometimes there would be times when we would have telephone tensions which would build up. I would cry, he would tell me not to, but that would just make it worse. I would accuse him of being cold. He would say I was looking for pity, ect. Then either one of us would say "let's take a break for a couple of days" in which we wouldn't call each other. He would almost ALWAYS be the one to call back first, saying things like, "Do you still remember me? Do you love me?" I loved it when this would happen, as I had the "upper" hand at those times. Then it would be great between us for a while until I would make the common mistake of calling him too many times- this is a cycle- I would then feel resentment that he seemed aloof (it was my own fault) which wasn't really true, I was reading into things that weren't there- He would feel attacked, and another downward spiral would result, then it would go back up again, ect..

 

The last time I saw Motti was during the summer and early autum when I came to try it out again and live together. He thought I was going to live with him on a permanent basis and I thought so too, but at the last moment I got a letter from my university which stated that I had recieved a full scholarship (I never even applied for one!) to continue my final year there. I had not planned on finishing my degree so fast, but I didn't want to turn the money down, and he had his clients still... He encouraged me to take advantage of the opportunity and said he would just have to wait until I finished.

Anyhow, during the last time we were together we adapted better to each other, but still had some silly arguements. I mean really stupid arguements that I could have prevented easily. Despite these arguements he told me he still thought that this wasn't the "end".

 

Ever since I've come back "home" I have been very depressed. More than ever before and we've had some very upsetting arguements. My bad moods (confrontational) have affected our relationship to the point where he says things like "we have a problem and I don't see a solution."

My reaction to this is, "you don't believe in me anymore, you're being so negative. Why don't you want to break up with me if that's how you feel?"

His response is "I don't want to break up. I want to be with you, but I can't see a solution to our arguements."

This type of dialogue easily puts into a panic state where I will start to cry and accuse him of judging things too quickly. Then he says, "See, you can't control your moods. That's exactly what I'm talking about (he refers to my crying)." This only provokes me to get more upset because it feeds into my fears of abandonment, to which I start acting emotionally out of control by saying things like, " You hate me! If you really loved me you would accept me for who I am and you wouldn't be so damn analytical!"

His response is,

"I love you, but the price is too high. I can't afford these arguements. I'm just asking for you to be reasonable"

ME: How can you be so calm and cold?! (Exploding with anger)

MOTTI: You want me to be cry like you. you think I'm happy?!

I am also suffering, if this makes you feel better to know

ME: But I NEED you now and you're not available to me!!! I

need your warmth right now, not your reason!

MOTTI: I can't give it to you now because maybe I'm the one in

need of being comforted. How can we live together if

we argue like this?

ME: It's your fault! If you weren't so pessemistic all the time

these arguements would never happen.

MOTTI: Ah, so it's all MY fault! (offended) You only think about

what YOU want. You don't care about me.

 

This is just an example of a typical argument we have on the phone. This last time (yesterday) happened because of an incident (I posted the details of this incident on the RELATIONSHIP forum last week) in which I did something that invovled breaking his trust in me. He forgave me for it, and things seemed to be getting better until I noticed he was being distant and not telling me things. This caused another erruption yesterday when he told me he still hadn't gotten over what I did, and I told him that he shouldn't let this incident "win" that he should use it to bring us closer together, not farther apart. I told him in a message I left on his machine something that went like this:

I can't take the fact that you are siphoning me off. This is worse than breaking up. I think you've punished me enough and I've suffered ten times what you have.

 

He called me back thinking I had "dumped" him, and I told him I hadn't. He then (to my horror!!!) suggested that we do "what I had said on the message" (break up). I panicked saying I didn't mean that I wanted to break up and to please "stop talking like that"

He then told me he wanted to take a break because he saw that our conversations only led to suffering on both parts. I agreed to this, and he told me he'd call me back after we'd had sufficient time to think things over. He made me promise I would tell my psychiatrist everything about what had happend and to try and find a solution.

 

Can somebody please help me understand his behavior? Is he breaking up?

[butterflyz]

well, i don't know how to approach your situation.

 

it seems as though you both have very different ways of relating to each other and handling problems.

 

it seems that he wants you to conform to his way of doing everything, which is ridiculous. relationships go both ways. i believe that there needs to be acceptance of both parties for each other. both will have to put up with the wierd habits that the other has.

 

it doesn't matter if you both are in love, if you can't relate and get along, it's all for nothing. he seems cold to you, you seem over emotional to him. unless you both can come to some middle ground, i can't see it working. you both need to take a step towards each other.

 

as far as his "daddy" behavior goes, just cut him off when he starts. like, if he starts lecturing you about your carbs say, "thank you, i'll eat my way, you eat your way." don't react to it (i know it's hard to do so). eventually he'll realize you'll do what you want to do, and you'll change when you are ready to do so.

 

he's not breaking up with you, he's trying to get you to conform to him and relate to him on his level of communication. he shuts down if it gets too emotional. i, now, when confronted by a significant other, just shutdown too. it may not be the best way for me to deal with it. but it's better than getting into a screaming match. i still have a temper, but i am trying better to control it. it was terrible when i was a kid. so, i understand why he doesn't want to deal with you when you can't talk in a constructive manner. but, we are human, and we feel. and to expect you to be perfect, is farfetched. if someone were to expect me to be perfectly in control of my emotions all the time, i'd tell them to take a hike.

 

but he needs to meet you halfway. for YOU to completely conform is unfair and unwise. if you do so, he'll always feel he can control you.

 

you will need to talk to him about this, but you'll need to do it calmly. get together and discuss what you see from a step back. just state that you don't feel that you are connecting anymore and you would like to come to some middle ground, but for you to completely conform would be destroying who you are, and who you are is what he fell in love with.

 

see what he says. if he maintains his position of not meeting you halfway, then you only have two choices: to stay with him and lose your identity completely, or leave.

[Amneris]

THis morning I went out grocery shopping and when I came back my room mate told me that Motti had called while I was out.

My first reaction was happiness as I thought he might be already missing me, or concerned about me, but then later my imagination went a bit wild and I thought that maybe he had called to say he wanted to break up for real.

 

I didn't call him back (He doesn't have to know that I got his message, and he didn't leave any message for me to call back anyhow) and won't because the "deal" was that I was not to call him during this break. He told me he would call me when he was ready.

Why do you think he called?

 

He isn't calling tonight and I don't expect he will because if we have conversations at night they risk to go on too long, then he ends up sleep deprived (he is two hours ahead of me) or if we argue he will often have very bad dreams. Sometimes he even has palpitations if we argue before he goes to sleep. (this only ever happens on the phone. Never when we are together)

 

Thanks for your input

[Ally Boo]

Just from reading the first part of your post, I can tell you...

 

1) He has no respect for you.

 

2) He thinks you are incapable of doing things "right"

 

3) He treats you like a child...or worse, a client.

 

Walk away now, before he destroys your sense of self worth. Just bc he's a psychitrist, DOESN'T mean he doesn't have issues...

 

Tell him he has more issues than Time Magazine...and your subscription just ran out. hehe

[butterflyz]

why not? this way you'll find out once and for all.

 

try not to be a dreamer about how he'll realize he's wrong, etc. most times, it doesn't work out that way.

 

what you need to think about is what you are going to do. one way or the other. even if he wants you back, do you go? will you establish some boundaries? or will you let him make you crazy again?

 

and you need to decide that if he can't change or meet you half way, do you still want him.

 

not to hurt your feelings, he doesn't sound like quite a catch to me.

[Amneris]

Okay last night he called again, but I didn't pick up the phone because I saw it was his number on call display, but later when my room mate got home he called again asking for me and she called me to answer the phone.

He was all "mushy gushy" and warm, asking how I was and saying that he had tried hard to reach me. I was afraid to get into a discussion, besides, I was also very exhausted and physically recovering from the stress of the day before, so I just told him in a very neutral tone that I was really tired. He asked me if I was going to university the next day (just simple questions like that as it was clear he sensed I was being distant from him this time)

He sensed that I didn't have much to say, so he let me go and I thanked him for his call and we said goodnight.

 

Now I know it sounds like I am not being very true to him by being "cold" but I am so afraid of being exposed and vulnerable with him where I risk to loose control like I did the other day. Whenever the "cycle" gets to this point (where he is the conerned person and I am sort of aloof) I feel the strongest and most capable to deal with him, but my problem is HOW can I keep it so that I stay "here"? I don't want the cycle to repeat itself again where I become the weak one, or the victim. I realize that I play into the "role" of the victim myself even though he contributes to it.

 

Should I call him or just play it cool? (I was out the whole day and just came back)

[midori]

This situation really does sound like a bad one to me, one that you don't want to be in for either the short or the long run. But if you're determined to keep on trying, it sounds to me like you're most confident and comfortable when you've been pushed by him to a point where you've had to retreat on your principles in the face of his aggressive, overbearing, self-absorption. Once he's pushed you to the limit and you know that you have no more room to compromise, you become strong and refuse to budge, even at the expense of the relationship. He realizes this, and changes tactics, becoming concerned and solicitous, to lure you away from the edge that he's pushed you to, so that you will again become the relationship's guardian and maintenance worker.

 

I must point out that such behavior suggests that he is a bad person to be involved with at all. If he can only be kind, interested in your perspective, and respectful when he senses that he's pushed you too far, what kind of person is he? Lots of people who work in psychology and psychiatry are canny about dealing with people's boundaries -- but that doesn't mean they have good intentions.

 

Anyway, if you're determined to continue, it seems to me like you need to extend your boundaries, become implacable and unyielding BEFORE things reach the point where you're exhausted and defeated and ready to throw in the towel. Why is this guy's perspective more valid than yours? Why must you comply, conform, silence yourself just to facilitate interaction with him? Good grief. He sounds like a moron. You're probably twice as smart, twice as perceptive and intuitive as he is. Don't let him get away with arrogant proclamations, or half-baked self-indulgences. Challenge him on things that you disagree about. Stand your ground! If he gets nasty with you (as he will), if it appears that your challenging him threatens the very foundtion of the relationship -- so what? He can't take it -- so what? Just shows how insecure he really is if he can't entertain other people's perspectives, if he can't exchange ideas in a mature way. Why is it up to YOU to tolerate, silence yourself, etc. just to maintain the relationship? If it's important to him, he'll compromise. If he can't compromise, too bad -- because he's no better, no more "right" than you are.

 

In other words, if you could manage to realize that he's not so great, if you can get yourself to the point where you're ready to walk away from the relationship when things get nasty/ridiculous/insulting, and NOT CARE about whether or not things get patched up -- or at least not care to the point where you're the one making all of the compromises, doing all of the work to patch things up -- maybe, maybe, maybe things would improve. Maybe. To be honest, you'd probably just find that you're sick of his crap and just move on. But you'd have regained your dignity, and you'd be in control of the situation, insofar as you'd remain in it for as long as you deemed appropriate.

 

But I must say, it sounds like you're miles away from getting to such a healthy perspective in this relationship. You're still taking your cues from him, letting him say when and where. He calls, you avoid the phone (passive resistance), but when your roommate calls you to the phone you take the call. You could have said, "tell him I've gone to bed/am indisposed/will call him tomorrow." What if you'd said that? What would have happened?

[butterflyz]

it's a vicious cycle.

 

you say you feel strong now because of the way you are behaving and want to know how to stay there.

 

you are still in the cycle, so you are really not in a position of strength. you need to stop the cycle and talk to this person, state your needs and see if he responds favorably. it doesn't sound like he will.

 

my experience with pompous asses like this guy is that they need the "mouse" to their "cat". you are nothing more than a toy to him. i don't want to sound cruel, because there are emotions involved. you may like the back and forth routine, but, just take the call next time, suggest to meet for coffee. right down on a list the things you can live with and the things you can't live with. it may sound cold, but bring the list and go over it with him. see how he responds. you need to watch him from a removed stand point, not with any love in your "eyes" as you watch him to see if he is sincere. i can look at someone now and know when they are full of crap. i may not confront them at the time. my philosophy is to give people just enough rope to hang themselves. and when they do, i just watch them swing.