Is it all my "emotional issues"?

[luvstarved]

OK I have been around on the board, sexless marriage, blah blah...now not sexless but not passionate either...

 

The last couple of days I have been in a funk over this oppressive feeling of sadness over my perception of my husband as somewhat narcissistic and paranoid and lazy but above all - not being interested in me romantically, and pondering whether it is something I can find a way to live with, given the otherwise rather comfortable and secure life we share.

 

I totally admit that I go into a funk when it gets to be too much - and the catalyst is usually when we don't have sex and I know he has pleased himself, because that is what he PREFERS to do. I am cordial but distant to him at these times and yes, anyone would know that I was in a funk.

 

Well today he kind of forced the issue, what is on your mind and I did my best to express my feelings to him about being needed but not wanted, etc.

 

His reaction was basically to suggest that I had deep emotional issues that he wasn't sure he could live with, and a suggestion that I was selfish and uncommitted if I was considering leaving a marriage just because he wasn't "romantic enough".

 

I tried to cite other things he has done to show that he only cares about his own needs and not mine but if it was a clear and glaring example, then he "never said that" or "that never happened". Basically, he does what he wants to do and simply does not consider other people, but gets very offended if he is treated the same. Like, he gets up this morning and tells me where he is going and when he will be back, but does not ask or even consider whether I might have something to do (someone has to stay home with kids). That's just how he operates.

 

He rightfully pointed out that he does not smoke, drink, do drugs, womanize. He comes home every night and kisses me when he leaves and last thing at night. He gives me presents on every occasion, even though they are pretty thoughtless and generic ones. He willingly goes to counseling - until the counselor starts to hone in one his issues - and then that counselor is well-meaning but not quite competent enough. Then we go to another counselor until that counselor also becomes an idiot by suggesting that HE has issues.

 

Today he suggested that if he is not jazzed about me it is because I have not offered him enough emotional warmth - and a little later tried to suggest that it was a past relationship that must have skewed my thinking, etc (well I have been with HIM for 10 years, so when is the past the past??) and an assortment of other things that all had to do with me having "emotional problems" or failing to meet HIS needs. Anyway it is always someone else's fault or flaw, never his.

 

Finally I told him that this was exactly the problem - I try to reach out wiht my feelings and instead of being met with sympathy and an effort to come up with a mutual plan - it is just that I am a nut and he is a prince and nothing is ever good enough for me and he doesn't see why he should have to put up with it.

 

But - it isn't even that he is a prince. He has a lot of anger and throws little hissies if people don't comply with his wishes, he disrespects in the sense of not acknowledging others' property or feelings (takes other people's food from fridge without asking, turns off lights or tv even though someone else is using, expects people to drop what they are doing and do what he wants them to do, "teases" by making remarks like "I am the only one who knows how to do anything around here", "nobody understands me but the dog", "I am always low man on the totem pole", "nobody cares about my feelings", when clearly we have and do and have told him that these remarks are negative and hurtful and asked him not to make them). Generally when I have tried to talk about the sex thing, it is "there is no problem, you are making a problem where there is no problem" and other topics where I try to voice my needs and am told that my needs aren't my needs, if he misinterprets something I say and I tell him I didn't mean it the way he took it, *I* am wrong - i.e., he knows my intentions and feelings better than I do...(and he IS wrong, I am not doing subtle stuff and not owning up to it...he got royally pissed one day, after I had worked overnight on a project - he asked me a question and I said "yeah...", just kind of distracted and he was like "THAT's all the answer I am going to get???" and then insisted that I had some nefarious reason for a one word answer - and the question was something like "are you going to the gym today?", not "are you committed to this marriage" or similar...

 

He also does virtually NOTHING around the house. I take care of virtually EVERYTHING so it isn't at all like I need him. In fact, I told him that I thought the problem was that he needed me but didn't want me and that I want him but don't need him. His response was "but I like to take you to baseball games and go places with you, how many husbands can say that? That proves I DO want you". Not what I meant, but made me feel like a sex perv for what I did mean. Sheesh.

 

I feel so fed up and frustrated but today for the first time it sounded like he would accept a divorce where in the past he always got panicky and promised to change, etc. and I admit that kind of scared me, like my bluff was being called! Because he is right - he is reliable and loyal and all of that...and I wonder...AM I expecting too much?

 

The truth is, I DO Love him despite his faults - because I have mine too and we all do, and he does have his positives - so WHY does it seem like such a dealbreaker for me that he is not romantically interested in me? Should I NOT be content with what I have? Am I a nut????

[Storyrider]

I don't think you're a nut. It is reasonable to expect your husband to be romantically interested in you.

 

I would say you need to make it hurt more for him on a daily basis. Not so much punish him, but provide natural consequences, just like you would with a child, so that he doesn't keep getting rewarded for bad behavior.

 

You could stop cleaning up after him, for one thing. Stop doing his laundry and see what he does when he runs out of clean underwear. If he has to deal with his own mess, he might be more inclined to change.

 

You could be gone when he comes home for his bland nightly kiss hello. Take the kids out for a hamburger or something. But don't rub it in or say anything. If he asks where you were, just act surprised and like it is no big deal.

 

I think he is taking advantage of you because he can. He takes you for granted.

[Shattered Reality]

Luvstarved... I am in a very similar situation as you are, in fact I think we talked in one of the sexless marriage threads not too long ago. So I can totally relate to what you are going through.

 

There are a couple of main issues in my relationship that I think need to be resolved if he and I are going to make it. And one of these is the intimacy. Quick pecks on the cheek and the 'I love you's are just not enough. I KNOW he loves me, but I think that actions speak louder than words, and his actions do not support the words that are coming out of his mouth. His rejection of me over and over and over again has really worn me down to the point where I dont' even try anymore. Why set myself up just to be shot back down again?

 

I think deep down he realizes that there is a problem, but he refuses to do anything about it. Won't go to therapy. Won't use the medication his doctor gave him for his low testosterone. A person can only do so much, you know? I can't MAKE him do anything that he doesn't want to do. And then you get to the point where you don't even want to try anymore.

 

He is not a bad guy. He has a lot of great qualities that I admire in him. But sometimes I dont' know if they are enough to compensate for the bad. While he is loyal (and this I do not doubt) and a good provider for our family, he is also verbally abusive to me and my kids. He says things to them like "Can't you do what I asked you to do, for once in your miserable little life?" He is very controlling, using emotional barbs to get us to do what he wants us to do. If I am busy doing something and he decides to talk to me, if I am distracted he gets angry also, because I didn't drop what I was doing to focus on him and his needs.

 

His excuse for all this is that he is not happy in his job. That and his temper is hereditary from his dad and grandfather. I have a hard time buying that. Sometimes I think that if we could just regain the intimacy in our lives that the good effects from that would spread throughout the rest of our issues, helping to solve them too. I just don't know though.

 

This has been on my mind constantly for the past 6-9 months, and I still haven't come up with any solutions. On one of the other threads, several people suggested that the wake up call of me leaving might be the only way to get his attention, and maybe they are right. The main thing keeping me from doing this though is my kids. They would be smack dab in the middle of all this if it happened, and they do not need the extra turmoil that this would cause. It has been an extremely rough year for us, with my aunt dying of cancer, my grandpa just put into hospice with cancer, along with dealing with my kids who both have ADHD, among other things. I just don't know if I could put them through anything else.

 

Okay, now that I hijacked your thread for my story (sorry about that) I agree with Storyrider. I think that you should stop cleaning up after him for starters. And you need to take back your life, as far as being able to go out once in a while, and he can watch the kids. I dont' necessarily think that you need to just 'disappear' and be gone, but I would just tell him, okay I"m going out to lunch with the girls on Saturday, so I need you to be home to watch the kids... or something like that. Not asking, telling. But also not leaving it to the last minute so he can't say he had other plans. You can do this and still be curteous, because if you aren't you are just going down to his level.

 

As far as him thinking that you are making a problem where there is no problem... he is blind. When you are a couple, if one person perceives something to be a problem, than it is an issue for both of you. His refusal to validate your concerns is wrong. Of course, knowing that and getting him to change are two different things. But it's obvious to me, from reading your post, that your issues go above and beyond the intimacy issues. Trust, respect, curtesy, compassion... the things that make a marriage work, are all missing or broken. You ARE NOT making too much of this.

 

Anyway, sorry this got kinda long. Hang in there and good luck to you... I am here in the same boat as you, so you are not alone

[Mz. Pixie]

He rightfully pointed out that he does not smoke, drink, do drugs, womanize. He comes home every night and kisses me when he leaves and last thing at night. He gives me presents on every occasion, even though they are pretty thoughtless and generic ones. He willingly goes to counseling - until the counselor starts to hone in one his issues - and then that counselor is well-meaning but not quite competent enough. Then we go to another counselor until that counselor also becomes an idiot by suggesting that HE has issues.

 

 

 

This is such a cop out. Do you do any of those things?? Do you drink, smoke, do drugs or run around after men?? Why does he think that just because he does these things you're a nut if you're unsatisfied???

 

My ex husband used to use that line on me all the time and then turn around and do stuff just like your H. Like making plans and just assuming I'll be home to take care of the kids.

 

By the way, when you talk about romance are you talking about romance (flowers candy dates etc) or sex? Because the beginning of your post it sounds like sex.

 

Why is it, when we expect more from our men, they cite that we have "deep emotional issues"???

 

By the way, he does sound like a narcassist. Perhaps not full blown but definitely he has issues- like rewriting the truth as you pointed out in your earlier post- they definitely do that.

 

I believe that eventually in all marriages that inital lust fades- and things are less romantic- but that there is a deeper love there under it all.

 

Only you can decide if you can live with this the rest of your life.......

[Road Rage]

Luvstarved

 

You are living in an emotional vacuum. The inevitable result will be you having an affair. It may even catch you by surprise. When your emotions are bottled up long enough it is surprising to what degree it is possible to just do it.

 

Sadly I don`t know the answer except to just try to keep working on it until the curtain drops. You are an attractive woman, I`ve seen your pic. Jody can`t be too far out there.

[luvstarved]

Well, yeah...I posted about 5-6 months ago stating that I was immune to an affair, but cripes I haveta maybe retract that. Hopefully not.

 

But...you know, a lot of it is about sex, but not so much the act itself, just having lover status and a sense of mutual WANTING. I want my husband to desire me as I desire him. Romantically. He is actually pretty good about the "dates" thing but it is more because he is big into recreational activities than being eager to bond. When these dates go well, it is kind of superficial "see that was fun, right?" More avoiding talking about issues that hang over the situation than getting back to the old days.

 

But...my hurt mostly comes from acts that I consider insensitive, like these very recent ones:

 

exhibit A - I stayed up all night writing a 30 page letter about our relationship. His response was that I should not have stayed up all night. He expressed no curiosity about the letter, which I later just tore up.

 

exhibit B - I sent him two ecard Valentines, one I wrote a poem for, spent a fair amount of time on. He deleted them without reading them then denied that he received them. When I asked if I should resend: "if you want to"

 

exhibit C - I have made casual hints at no pressure times in the past about how receiving flowers at work is one of my favorite things. His reaction: yeah but that is just such a waste of money ($50-60 for flowers a waste: concert tix @ 80 a pop and baseball tickets at 90 a pop: wise investment??? apparently). guess what? no flowers. I got the $10 supermarket carnations for Valentine's Day but of course he tells the kids they're for "everyone".

 

exhibit D - a guy at work has a crush on me, makes remarks, looks, etc. I mentioned to my H and he said that the guy probably is just trying to flatter me to get ahead. not only no jealousy, but no belief that I could evoke a crush.

 

exhibit E - an old and HOT flame tracked me down like a dog and called me. My H was not the least bit curious about this.

 

Well I could go on for pages. The point is, he just doesn't seem to have "it" for me anymore. Look I know things are not as steamy after 10 years as they are in the first year but...they can also be so satisfying and intimate and sensual and he is JUST NOT INTERESTED. It really bites because I am SOOOOO open-minded and willing and...all I get is this virtual watching him masturbate for most of the event type of sex. And I mean he really avoids it...and then blames it all on my lack of emotional warmth. Which is strange since I think the truth is that he does not want to have to GIVE to me sexually.

 

I had a kind of wild past and I do not long for those days, but I am not a slouch in the sack at all. Been told by several guys that I was the "perfect lover" because I am open minded and willing but still can come across as somewhat sweet and shy at the same time. So I am not a prude and not some kind of demanding dominatrix type either.

 

And this whole angle that he is blaming me is wearing thin too. He can't cite any actual examples of my being negligent or emotionally cold or whatever he is talking about but then: he has his own reality. And doing or saying ANYTHING to avoid blame for himself is as real as it gets.

 

We have counseling tomorrow. Sigh. Last time the counselor started to zero in on him so of course he took this as her "taking sides" and being "unprofessional". When I suggested that perhaps she saw something objectively that he might need to work on: NOPE! She's biased and way out of line (translation: guess that will be the last session with her).

 

Heck I don't know. Just continuing the vent. Don't mind me folks.

[Road Rage]

I understand how difficult all this must be for you luvstarved. At least you are working on your relationship. I wish you joy and fulfillment soon:bunny:

[Guest]

Run away from this man. Run far, far away. Seriously.

[loggrad98]

I think there are other issues here than just he is a jerk (that is way too easy to say and I think it is often a cop-out...sometimes it is true, but often it is not the ONLY issue).

 

It sounds to me like he is dealing with some form of retroactive jealousy. I have posted on this myself and I can tell you that some of what he is doing is common among men who are dealing with this. You admitted you had kind of a wild past, and that can be very intimidating and difficult to deal with (and not just for men). I learned through counseling and talking to my doctor that jealousy to some degree is normal in committed relationships, but that it can often be exacerbated by chemical imbalances and other emotional problems.

 

I am now on medication for borderline bipolar and going to a counselor regularly to deal with post-cancer depression and RJ that was made worse by the depression. I know that in the thick of it there were times when I withheld emotion and passion and affection, not as a punishment, but because I could not get some of those images out of my head and did not want to build a connection of picturing my wife with other men and our sex life. In a way it was protecting myself at my wife's expense and something I have come to terms with...and begged her forgiveness for.

 

We have a fantastic relationship now - sex life, friendship, parenthood...better in all areas (per my wife, not just from my end) and I thank my doctors and therapist for helping. Not to mention the wonder-pill, Lamictal. =)

 

But it had to come from within. I finally reached the end of my rope with my depression (almost literally) and the RJ was the icing on the cake, so I got help. It has to come from him to get help. You can encourage him to get help, and going to counseling together is a good thing, but until he is ready to accept that at least part of all this is centered in him, you will not see a change. If that is the case, and if it persists, the best course of action, for you both, may be to part ways. He can find someone whose past he can handle and you can find someone who can handle your past.

 

Just my opinion, but I think this may be worth looking into.

[scubafish]

luvstarved, there is a book out there called 'He's just not that into you', by greg behrend, and it sounds alot like your guy!

[boshemia]

I have no answers for you, only good thoughts. If I knew what to do I wouldn't keep getting myself into the exact same relationships.

 

Recently my thirteen year old was whining about not being allowed to date, and that I just didn't understand what it was like to be alone. I pointed out that being in a relationship like you described is even more lonely than just being single. When you are single nobody is supposed to hold you, or talk to you, or snuggle you... so it's not so bad...

 

But when someone IS there to do all of those things, and chooses not to it's a total rejection of who you are as a person. They could do those things, they just choose not to...

 

I'm sorry you are going through this... but I'm sending happy thoughts your way.