Money problems have created a chasm

[mogster]

Hello all, i wonder if the resident experts can help. I am sad and tired of arguing! I want to talk to my wife but dread the inevitable argument that will start after about 5 minutes of pleasant conversation. As a result i feel i am starting to lose someone who i once cherished and admired.

 

 

 

I work in the oil industry which involves working away from home for 5 weeks out of every 10. The industry is suited for younger men up to 45 years old I would say. I like to save money so one day when I am older than 45 years I wont have to go and work in this environment (I am 38). That’s my plan! Every month I give my wife an allowance for household bills and her expenses but we have got to the stage where she always wants more. She is a housewife and we have a baby boy and a 20 year old daughter.

 

 

About two years ago I was called away at short notice and I didn’t have time to get her a cheque or bank transfer sorted out so I gave her my bank card for 5 weeks while I was away. The money leaked out like a sieve over successive days and I couldn’t fathom how she was spending so much. Although when I questioned the bank statement she had many reasons for the large expenditure such as bills, medicine for the baby and such.

 

We have had two agendas recently. I have been getting our home refurbished, painted and decorated and have amassed quite a bill to be paid over several months. Meanwhile my wife started to build a small (1 bedroom) house for her mum and dad. This was initially budgeted for but over 3 months the house is now 3 times the original budget. As a result I am struggling to pay the bills for our house (which I consider the main priority). I also had plans for the money she has spent (ie. new washing machine and play room for our growing son).

 

So basically, now, nearly every time we start talking we end up arguing about money. She spends over and beyond her means and I like to budget and save so i can hopefully one day retire a few years earlier as a result.

 

The other thing causing resentment is that I like the house we live in, but the wife wants to move closer to her parents, which I am not prepared to do. So basically she criticizes anything I do or spend on our present house and I resent her spending on a house 2 hours flight away that we will visit maybe twice a year.

 

I love my wife. I love my son even more and I can’t imagine life without him. So I need to repair this situation. I want to be able to go home and relax after 5 weeks away at work and have my wife enjoy being with me and us getting along again.

 

All advice and suggestions appreciated. Hoping to become a happy family again.

[dropdeadlegs]

I don't have any good advice because I am very controlling about money and would be very upset in your shoes. I read your previous thread concerning your mum and your post deserves attention because you have such a good attitude concerning advice received on this forum. For these reasons, I am replying to bump your thread back to the top of the new posts in the hopes that those who can give you something valuable, versus my empathy, will see it. It was back on page 3, so now it's back on page one.

 

Good luck to you, money issues are difficult for me in marriage.

[mogster]

Yes, thanks for the kind words. This forum was extremely helpful to me before. Was hoping for similar enlightenment. Maybe giving her more money will help?

[what2donow]

Money is a big issue in my marriage. I'm a SAHM and I also get an allowance for bills and such each month. I can only tell you MY perspective, but in reading your post, what caught my attention was all the "I" references: "I like to budget...", "I like to save money..", "I've been getting our home refurbished...", "I also had plans for the money she spent...".

 

As the spouse of a somewhat money-controlling H, this type of attitude just rips away at my self-esteem. The final decision on any major, and most minor, expeditures are my husbands, and I have to tell you that just sucks. I don't feel like a partner in the marriage or family. It builds resentment. If you are as controlling as it came across to me in your post, I'm not at all surprised she went to town on the bank card. I've done this myself. By controlling the money and how it's allocated you're basically denying her the ability have any control of her life. Men aren't the only ones that like to control things! For me, I felt like a child when my H would look over the grocery bills because he thought I spent too much. WTF?? I might not be working outside the house to earn cash, but I work my arse off taking care of the kids and the house and worrying about all the day-to-day things. Then you're going to tell me I can't make decisions about OUR money?

 

He made a budget once. He showed it to me and explained how much can be spent on what. Guess what happened to that? I'm not saying I went out and overspent, but I didn't put any real effort into keeping it, and eventually, it went away. Childish I know, but to tell me how to spend money, well it was just plain insulting.

 

My only suggestion is to sit with your wife, as a team, and ASK for her input on a budget, for the family--not just her. When my H finally let go of some of that control to me, I felt like I was contributing to the family and TOGETHER we were making decisions about OUR lives. Now we have a budget that I'm responsible for because I helped establish it. It's not just HIS money, but OURS. I'm much more motivated to keep within its boundaries, and we argue less about money now that he's not checking on every expenditure I make.

 

I wish you luck, and I hope this helps!!!

[mogster]

^

Thanks for the excellent reply. I think what you just wrote is probably exactly what my wife would have written.

 

Any money spent in our household definately originates from me and i guess this is why i am so protective of it. Having said that i am by no means selfish, ever. I just like to see value for what gets spent and this is where i argue with my wife.

 

I can see we are going to have to sit down and have a chat about this. I just keep thinking, what if i open a shared bank account and see how we go. But then i keep worrying about what would happen if everything got spent within a few weeks.

 

What financial situation with your husband would make you happiest?

If you say, complete control over all funds so i can spend spend spend, at least it will help me with my planning.....

[what2donow]

We're still working on it, but this is what is currently working for us. We have a joint checking account, out of which all "household" expenses are paid -- groceries, utilities, etc. I have my own checking account which is for clothing/shoes for me and kids, plus for any get-away/fun activities. That's a real motivation for me to save! H has his own checking account for his personal expenses (clothes, etc).

 

We went back four months and averaged all household expenses, and these became our budget limits. If for some reason one of the items goes over budget, we have to inform the other. I'm not talking about a few $$'s, but anything over 15%. If one wants a particular item over $100, we discuss it and jointly decide if it's a need/want and if we agree to buy it, money comes out of the joint household account. If we don't both agree to the purchase, it comes out of the personal account.

 

Hope that helps!!

[Very_Confused]

My husband and I are having problems with the issue of money right now, along with other issues that I have posted about before. It's not a lack of money. I work full-time and make a very decent income and my husband makes an excellent salary. The problem is that since he moved back home last fall it's become "his and her money" because that is the way he wants it. During our 7 month separation we both opened separate checking accounts and he also opened a separate savings account for himself. That is a new development in our almost 8 year marriage. Before our separation any money that came into the house was "ours" and we had one joint checking account.

 

For this to make any sense I guess I need to give a little bit of history. We separated once before, about 5 years ago, and money was one of the problems that led to that separation. Back then it was a lack of money. We reconciled and over the next few years our financial status improved and of course that helped relieve some of that stress on our relationship. We weren't rich but things were looking up financially.

 

In January of last year my husband got a major promotion and, along with that, a 35k a year salary increase which put him over 6 figures. I work for the same company and have since 1998. I had to step down from my position and move to another department to avoid a conflict of interests. One week later he told me he was moving out.

 

During the first two months of our separation he had the financial means to pay off his share of the few bills that I consider non-living-expenses (credit card, line of credit, etc.). I make the very last payment to my share tomorrow, yay! He gave me child support for our son during our separation and I worked 48 hours a week, every week. So I was able to make ends meet and even pay a little extra on those bills along the way and stick to my goal of having them paid off in 12 months.

 

Since he moved back in last fall everthing has remained separated because he insists on it. He pays his bills. I pay my bills (which includes the house). And he gives me an "allowance" each payday to go towards utilities, groceries, house pmt, etc. Everything else goes in his checking and savings. He says that the savings is because he wants to buy land and build a house. And that would be great and exciting for me if he made me feel, in any way, that it was for "our land and house, our future". But it's "his savings".

 

Sometimes a bill comes up unexpectedly, is larger than usual or one of the kids needs money for something at school, clothes or shoes, and it doesn't always fit into my budget. That's when I have to ask him for extra "allowance". Do you know how humiliating that is? Trust me, very.

 

My mother was in a very bad car accident before Thanksgiving and for several months I was spending alot of time in the mornings taking care of her. During that time I did not work as many hours and had to ask him for extra money to pay my bills. Now she doesn't need me quite as much so he told me I needed to start working 48 hours again every week so he could go back to the amount he use to give me We have argued about this too. Lots of resentment there. He works 9 to 5, has his nights and weekends free to do as he pleases, and gets angry with me if I don't work a full 48. I work full-time and then some, do all of the housework, laundry, the majority of the cooking, all of the dishes, run the kids back and forth, help with homework, etc. and he can't understand why I am frustrated. I told him a couple of days ago that there was a time in our marriage when he wouldn't have wanted me to work that much. He would have wanted me to be free in the evenings and on the weekends to spend time with him.

 

So that is just another issue we are having right now along with the lack of intimacy and affection. After our last discussion several days ago we have barely spoken. I really just don't have much to say. He dismisses my feelings so what's the point?

 

mogster ... I hope you and your wife can sit down and discuss all of this and come to an arrangement that you are both comfortable with. One that will bring you closer together in your marriage, rather than tearing you apart. Best of luck to you.

[Moose]

Cut her off!!!

 

When I welded for Penrod offshore, My checks were held until I got back. Noone could access them. I made sure the bills were paid up and beyond the time I got back.

 

If your wife gets mad, she'll get over it. If she threatens to leave, let her, she'll be back....

[mogster]

A-ha. The voice of the master at last.

You know, when i first started this relationship that was my sentiment exactly..."theres your allowance, take it or leave it.......i earned this money, i'm gonna spend it however i like"

 

We've been together 8 years now and although i know deep down i still feel the same, i have gradually softened to the point that i now feel she deserves her own independant pool of money to draw from. Unfortunately, I just think she'll waste every penny on things that nobody really needs and stuff that will be worthless in a years time.

 

As i said to her, trust me with the money and we will all have a lovely lifestyle.

 

So i guess there are the options......split my hard earned in 3 ways (wife's portion, house bills, my portion) or stick with the way things are and say "she'll be back when she wants more".

[Moose]

You know, when i first started this relationship that was my sentiment exactly..."theres your allowance, take it or leave it.......i earned this money, i'm gonna spend it however i like"

Well, to be honest, I think a better mind set would be, "theres your allowance, take it or leave it.....the rest of our earnings will be for future use"

We've been together 8 years now and although i know deep down i still feel the same, i have gradually softened to the point that i now feel she deserves her own independant pool of money to draw from.

It'll be hard to get it back to the way it used to be....but it has to be done, plain and simple. If she's gonna be on the team, she needs to dress accordingly to participate.....know what I mean?

Unfortunately, I just think she'll waste every penny on things that nobody really needs and stuff that will be worthless in a years time.

It's up to you to show her financial discipline. This was an EXTREMLY hard lesson for my wife to learn, she too has been, "cut off", several times.....now she's an active partner who has anything and everything she could possibly want....

As i said to her, trust me with the money and we will all have a lovely lifestyle.

Let me tell you from experience, simply telling her this isn't going to work.

 

My advice would be to lay out the budget in front of her, your 5 year plan, (we now have a 5 and 10 year plan), your goals, her goals, and map it out for her.... insisting that she be active in it, and obied by it....

 

If you have to, get her a pre-paid credit card and just refill it with her allowance.....take her name off of the other accounts until she can control her spending.....

 

I will also tell you this, when I was souly in charge of the monies, the bills did get paid each and every time, but things at home lacked as far as good clothes, furniture, even food......when Mrs. Moose was in charge, the bill never got paid, we got behind, but we had everything we needed at home....

 

It was when we both focused on our future when things turned around for us, and now everything is automatic, and falls together perfectly......

 

I know you're frustrated, and you're fixing to go through hell trying to get her to understand this....but it's worth it......

 

Good Luck!

[silktricks]

if you cut her off, you'll be treating her like a child - not saying she isn't acting like one, mind you. . . but treating your partner like she's your child certainly isn't going to make relationship better.

 

Part of the problem may be that as she doesn't normally have control of any money, she has no sense of what they boundaries can be.

 

I suggest, sitting down and discussing (as Moose said) what the overall plans are for your money, and your desire to be able to retire - or at least change occupations - within the next 7 years. What are her plans at that time? Does she have any interest in a career, or is she simply expecting that you will be able to finance your family at the same rate once your career changes. You might let her know, that the family income will probably reduce at that time, and explain that's why you need (it really is beyond want) to have the big expense items taken care of prior to that time.

 

There's nothing wrong with a budget. It's a good thing. An allowance has a bad connotation, but a budget -- different tone altogether. It turns out in the end to be the SAME thing, but sometimes the difference in how things are worded can mean alot.

 

BTW how old is your wife?

[mogster]

 

BTW how old is your wife?

 

Hi silktricks. My wife is the same age as me, 38.

 

Here's what I have come up with. I have split our expendable income 3 ways and will have it transfered into 3 accounts:

33% into wifes account

33% into my account

33% into household account for baby, bills, groceries.

 

The decorators bills i will take from my account and the household account.

The new washing machine I will probably buy from my savings.

 

Debts from her building project, i will pay half, she can use her account for any remaining or future bills. Flights to her parents she can pay for.

 

My mum and dad are coming to see their grandson next month. I shall pay for their hotel and flights.

 

I shall outline my plans to change jobs in 5-10 years time, and when we get on the straight and narrow again, hopefully we can live within our means.

 

She will have possession of the household account.

Should i secretly monitor the use of this money........or trust that it will be spent wisely on our household? Cus if it all vanishes on some stupid building project, i'm gonna get really angry.

 

Your thoughts appreciated...

[Moose]

Should i secretly monitor the use of this money........or trust that it will be spent wisely on our household?

No, you should make her aware that you'll be keeping a watchful eye on everything......it's your right to do so......

[Mirage222]

Tell her to GET A JOB - hire day care for the baby and go to work like more then half the world does.

 

You had a daughter when you were 8 years old?

[dropdeadlegs]

Tell her to GET A JOB - hire day care for the baby and go to work like more then half the world does.

 

You had a daughter when you were 8 years old?

Haha! Redo the math. 38 - 20 = 18. Definitely fertile years.

[DreOh6]

Ordinarily I would say get the heck out. You probably are going to say somewhere that she's a stay at home mom. Which is a big mistake. But never mind that.

 

Since you want to stay you should ask her to clear her schedule so you guys can have a meeting. Ask her to bring in writing what her ideas are for 1 year from now 5 years from now 20 years from now, etc. You tell her you will do the same. And then you both should be able to discuss what your priorities should be as a family.

 

If you are making enough money to be building a house for someone else before your own is done, then I would say you have enough money to pay alimony (because you can bet she'll ask for it). Just remember, you are in a prime position to divorce: you have only 1 young child and you seem to be able to afford the child support guidelines. You also would have to pay some alimony, but its tax deductible, so you'll come out on top anyway. Separate your finances so you'll have enough to be able to afford to get out. She obviously has no respect or knowledge of what it takes to earn that money. Believe me, if you don't get out now, you will be FORCED to work bask 48 anyway.

[mogster]

Thanks for the response. I have two weeks left offshore before i get to go home and have a meeting with the wife. I like the 5 year plan idea etc.

I also concur that my wife and I are 'finacially incompatible'.

 

I will consider eveything until then, but as usual, when you have been away for a month, you just want to go home and be happy and relax. See how things go.

 

Cheers

[silktricks]

Hi silktricks. My wife is the same age as me, 38.

 

Here's what I have come up with. I have split our expendable income 3 ways and will have it transfered into 3 accounts:

33% into wifes account

33% into my account

33% into household account for baby, bills, groceries.

 

The decorators bills i will take from my account and the household account.

The new washing machine I will probably buy from my savings.

 

Debts from her building project, i will pay half, she can use her account for any remaining or future bills. Flights to her parents she can pay for.

 

My mum and dad are coming to see their grandson next month. I shall pay for their hotel and flights.

 

I shall outline my plans to change jobs in 5-10 years time, and when we get on the straight and narrow again, hopefully we can live within our means.

 

She will have possession of the household account.

Should i secretly monitor the use of this money........or trust that it will be spent wisely on our household? Cus if it all vanishes on some stupid building project, i'm gonna get really angry.

 

Your thoughts appreciated...

 

Well, to be honest, I'd do it differently. The way you have it split out right now, she actually has 66% of the income to play with. As she has shown herself to be irresponsible financially, I probably wouldn't go there.

 

I'd do:

 

25% into long term savings.

 

25% into your acct

 

25% into her acct

 

25% into household acct.

 

If 25% isn't enough for household expenses, then I'd probably futz with your and her accts to increase the household acct. But I wouldn't futz with the 25% into longterm savings - which should be in your control until she shows that she's able to be fiscally responsible.

[Guest]

"You probably are going to say somewhere that she's a stay at home mom. Which is a big mistake. But never mind that."

 

Why is it noble to pay someone else to raise the child, but not for the stay at home mother/father to do so?

 

In the long run, up to until the full-time school years kick in, it is actually more economically feasible for a parent to stay at home with the child, provided, of course, that each person is somewhat fiscally wise with the family funds. Otherwise, pay what you would pay the day care provider each week to the person that stays home with the child. Logically, they are technically "doing more" with that child than the day care providers most likely would and really don't get compensated or are begrudgonly compensated. Sometimes, the 2nd parent working builds additional expenses...i.e. day care, a 2nd car, more petrol expense, repair/maintenance, lunches for work, clothes for work, etc...

 

Being a stay-at-home-parent does not mean a person isn't financially responsible, it just means that they either can't afford day care or would actually rather be the one to care for/teach their own child.

 

 

To OP: how about calling her "allowance" her "wages" for keeping up the homefront, leave her to do with as she pleases with her "wages", not keep track of how she spends "her wages" and if she runs out, she runs out, plain and simple - no more to until payday. (I like the 25% for future savings idea).

 

Honestly, when your gone for so long, she probably compensates her loneliness with shopping ( yeah, she may have friends and such around, but it doesn't exactly equal having your partner around.